This Week in WordPress #307

[00:00:04] Nathan Wrigley: It's time for this week in WordPress, episode number 307. Entitled, wearing many hats, literally.

It was recorded on Monday the 2nd of September, 2024.

My name's Nathan Wrigley, and I'll be joined by three fabulous people today. First by Courtney Robertson and by Bob Dunn, as well as Mark Westguard. Apart from the fact that I am literally wearing many hats, we do talk a bit about WordPress.

Gutenberg 19.1 has rolled around and we get into all of the bits and pieces. Some of which is the very, developer friendly and gives you lots of new capabilities, if you are a plugin or theme developer.

We also talk about the fact that Jamie Marsland has been given the job as the official WordPress YouTuber. What does that

mean? There's a new event in town. It's a masterclass with Tim Nash. You can find out how to attend that in-person if you're in the London area.

Also as an event, the WordPress accessibility day registrations are open to that.

The new learn.wordpress.org website has been around for a little while, but how can we promote it? How can we make sure that people actually know about it?

Half a billion? Let me say that again, half a billion, new WordPresses are going to be out there as a result of the new migration of Tumblr over to WordPress. If you are a Tumblr user, apparently you won't even notice the difference.

Do we need a marketing consortium to make it so that WordPress has some actual finances and clout in the background, so that all the people out there can learn about it?

And then we talk about data views and Mark shares some things that he's been working on over at WS Form.

It's all coming up next on this week in WordPress.

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Hi there. Good morning, good afternoon, good evening, and all of those other things. Good. Whatever time of day it is where you are. I appear to have developed in the last three minutes, quite a nasty cough and so I'll be coughing my way through this episode. I apologies about that. I will try to move the mic away, but it's gone all tickly.

you know that when you can't really control it. Anyway, here we go. Water. There it goes. Oh, good. Just don't make you laugh. Don't make you laugh. I'll share my, inhaler with you if you need it. I wish that was transportable over the internet. That would be lovely. I could well do with some of that.

that was the voice of Courtney Robertson. How you doing? Courtney? Nice to have you with us. I am doing okay. And I say, okay. Only in that August has been a month of breathing issues and I think I'm drowning in pollen. But otherwise, life is great. Oh gosh. are you, is that like hay fevery kind of stuff?

[00:04:41] Courtney Robertson: yes. So lots of hay fever, lots of coughing in my neighborhood too. Oh, okay. So maybe I've vicariously sucked some things through the internet. The only time I ever got hay fever in my life was in, central, the United States, like around Oklahoma, somewhere like that. I was driving through and I was on control.

[00:05:00] Nathan Wrigley: It was like streaming everywhere. And then I got out of Oklahoma, everything was fine. Just Oklahoma. Yeah. There you go. Here we go. Anyway, lemme introduce Courtney Robertson. She's got quite a long bio. I dunno if I'm gonna get through it all, but I'll do the. I'll do chop it up. Level items. Chop, I chop it up a little bit.

Courtney Robertson, an accomplished open source developer advocate at GoDaddy, a dedicated WordPress trainer, training team, faculty member, sorry, and a co-founding board member of the WP Community Collective. She effortlessly engages audiences with her relatable insights on getting involved in supporting contributors in the open source community.

I think I'll stop there. Courtney's everywhere. All at once. You know that film that was popular a couple of years ago, Courtney everywhere. Everything all at once. That's, that's what you are. And we're also joined by where we go. First, let's go Mark, mark, west Guard, who's beneath me. Ha. always beneath you no matter what the show.

Yeah. Sorry about that. I coughed at the same time. Mark's bio is significantly shorter. It goes like this. Mark is the founder of the w the WordPress form plugin, WS form. That's it. That's all I do. That's all I've ever done. No, that's all he does. You've got a cough there, mark. You've got a cough condemn.

No cough at all. And I've got water as well to Oh goodness. Prevent that. Lubricating the, voice. I'm very glad that you're with us. Thank you so much. we were supposed to be joined back by, Paul Halfpenny, but Paul Halfpenny, has had to suddenly take a break from the show and as luck would have it, Bob Dom was hovering on Twitter about an hour ago when I asked if anybody wanted to come and he immediately popped in and said, yeah, I'll do it.

And and look, all I can say is nice hat Bob. What's going on there? Where's your normal brimmed hat? Yeah, this one. I needed something for the flight over to Portland Word camp Us. It didn't have a brim and oh, this one just popped into my hands and I tried it on and it was rather horrifying at first 'cause I thought, God, I looked like some other podcaster, but then I, figured I'd just suck it up and not worry about it.

Okay. I wonder which horrible podcast that you, who could you be? I have no idea. although it does bear a striking similarity to my hat, God forbid that's what you meant. yeah, these hats are great. Like you say, when you're on a plane, you can just rest, can't you? 'cause there's no brim going all the way around.

anyway, what that's prompted is I've got a collection of about 20 hats next to me. Most of them are my school's kid hats, like winter hats and things like that. And so I've made it my mission during the course of this episode to wear every single one of them. and it's. Gonna be hard 'cause it really is genuinely a huge pile.

What I'm gonna have to do in a minute is plug some headphones in. 'cause I suddenly realized I won't be able to, how the heck is this gonna work? Look, if I try to get this little chap on how's, it's just gonna, I feel ready for sweating. Sledding with that hat. Yeah. For the audio listeners.

[00:08:09] Courtney Robertson: Yeah. I feel ready just to, this is a, like a knit beanie hat with a pompom on top. you gonna see to describe each, you gonna see that and so much more. Courtney, I bet you can't wait. The words, plumbing, new depths comes to mind. anyway, let's see. Show goes. Oh, we're off to a great start. Bob's bio, by the way.

[00:08:31] Nathan Wrigley: There's Bob. It's Bob. Bob, Don, look. There he is. There he is. is, goes as follows. Bob Don is a man with a new hat, which is just like a multitude, which Nathan Oreo, I wrote that biography. And, do you want, do you wanna give us your biography? What would you say about yourself, Bob? Oh, that, that pretty much sums it up at this moment in time.

perfect. Look, Courtney's in the spirit. She's gone and got herself a page. Is that Pagely logo? It is. It's a, I've never worn outside of my house. It goes with today's shirt, which is the page Lee. Long staple hoodie. Okay. Honestly, this show's gonna be, so we're, onto a fashion show, Adam. Oh, look, Everybody's got now. We've all got one. This is gonna be great. It's a fashion show. Yeah. honestly, a few weeks ago, Matt Mullenweg, word Camp Europe said he wanted WordPress to be more fun. And I thought to myself, hats, this show needs more. It's always been fun. Yeah. So that's what we're gonna do.

There you go. I'm following Matt's instructions, right? So that bit out the way the introductions are done, I'll just do the normal housekeeping stuff. thank you for joining us. If you are joining us live, that's great. Best place to do that. Oh, I can see there's a few comments there. That's really nice.

I'll get to those in a minute. best place to send people if you want your friends, colleague relations, whatever. to join us is go here, wp builds.com/live. Yeah, look, he's a pro. Look, I'm Mark. I'm not doing it. I'll get it. That's can't get it. Yeah, that's, yeah. Courtney don't even drive.

Oh gosh, this is gonna be tough. there you go. WP builds.com/live. Send your friends there. two options. If you are on the, if you're just using the regular browser, then you can use the comment box on the right, but it's, Google comments, it's YouTube, so you need to be logged into a Google account.

But if you don't like Google and you just wanna, use anonymous comments, then there's a little black box in the video player. You can click that. And you just type in your name and it's the, comments that come through the actual system itself. Okay. So yeah, WP builds.com/live. Thank you to those people who've already made a comment.

We've got Adam, Adam. who is that? What's that Avatar? I believe that is our friend Adam Silver from Kitchen Sink, WP Perfect. Who is sporting a Max Headroom look today. That was it today. Max Headroom. I remember that world. It's like that throwback to the eighties for the kids that don't know.

[00:11:02] Courtney Robertson: That was the first, I don't know, AI idea. I guess maybe I was exposed to, yeah, it was this talking head kind of video on MTV among other places. Yeah, it had like, cool computer graphics in the background. It was really cool. I used to love that show. thank you for joining us, Adam. That's great.

[00:11:22] Nathan Wrigley: he says, indeed it is Max Edra. Patricia says, hi. Nice to have you with us, Patricia. Friendly web GRA guy, which I now pretty much remember is Dave Gray. I think Dave, if it's not you, I apologize, but I think it is. Everyone got AV installed? oh, I like it. Yeah. Not me. Apparently. I'm on a Mac. I thought that would prevent me from getting anything, but clearly Courtney's virus has got right through it, and as always, Peter Ingersol brings us the weather.

From Connecticut. Good Labor Day. What the heck is Labor Day, by the way? What is that? I think you're supposed to work on Labor Day. Yeah. Oh, hi. I am here. I'm an American doing the typical American thing. what is it? It, is it like a national holiday? Everybody gets the day it, yes. And it celebrates, basically the end of summer informally, as well as giving workers the day off.

[00:12:17] Courtney Robertson: I would encourage folks to Google for more research. Okay. But it's a banking and school holiday for sure. A federal holiday. We have similar things that we just got them bank holidays, but this today is not one of them. Or at least I'm not aware. It is. I can't ignore them all in my defense. I also flex my time and will take off at other times.

Oh good. So all of you Americans that recognize I am on the clock right now. I don't know. I, trust me, I will be not around Friday afternoon. Okay. Okay. You're taking hotel manager anyway. Anyway, so the weather though, this is the important part. It's 21 degrees centigrade, 70 degrees Fahrenheit with clouds and sun.

[00:12:53] Nathan Wrigley: That's about what we've got here. Peter. It's about the same actually. yeah, you're in good company. Lawrence. Lawrence Lari, I'm guessing joining us from Australia unless he's moved. saying hello, everything. That was it. Everything everywhere. All at once. It was 2022, Adam giving us the knowledge.

Thank you so much. yeah, we are gonna be changing the hats. I'll do my first change in a moment. you can look forward to that. All of you. It's gonna be bad. a green Smurf hat. No, I don't have a green Smurf hat. I'm sorry Andrew Palmer. But I do have many. You'll see. and then Webber Holic Pay panel.

I'm seeing a lot of people moaning about WordPress and the direction they're going in. It almost feels like it's trending to hate on WordPress, not on this show. Web Aholic. We love the WordPress over on this show. I think, you're in safe grounds. Lots of comments. All feels negative and demoralizing.

You wait till you've seen the hats. Then you'll be happy. da dah. And I think Andrew Palmer saying My Ws form mug is chipped. I need another one. Please. I'll send you another one. If you could just organize that, please. Problem solved. God, there's so many comments. This is cra. Okay, I think I'm gonna have to stop there.

that'll do. I think for now, let's, let's crack on. Oh, okay. There we go. So here we go. It's this week in WordPress. We're gonna talk about WordPress, obviously, and this is our website, wp build.com. If you go to the site and you put your email address into this and click this button here, we'll send you a couple of emails a week.

Want to say, when we produce two of the things that we do, this is the first one and we repurpose it as a podcast episode, and it'll come out tomorrow morning at the ungodly time of 7:00 AM Who knows why we do that, but we do. so it'll come out tomorrow. And then also the podcast episode that we do on a Thursday.

So that's all you'll get. ramping up towards Black Friday. I might just spam the heck out of it, but I'm not intending to. You never know. but our sponsors look at these nice companies, GoDaddy Pro. Oh, thank you Courtney GoDaddy Pro. Keeping the lights on over here, but also Blue Host. Thank you to them and Omni Send.

And member full. And when we produce the content, we'll spin a proper ad in to tell you a bit more about their products and services. But thank you to those four companies. Really appreciate it. And let's crack on. Here we go. First article. Ah, what a joy to go to the WP Tavern website. And not see Nathan Wrigley's content.

it got a bit stale over there. But now we are back, and I, forgive me, JNA, I don't know how to pronounce your name. whoever you are, I really appreciate you stepping in and doing all this hard work. But the name is spelled J-Y-O-L-S-N-A, and I haven't had the good fortune of meeting this person yet, but I'm gonna say ner apologies again if I butchered it.

But thanks for the articles, which are now coming thick and fast. We'll show a few of them today. This first one came out on the 30th of August, and it's entitled Gutenberg 19.1. Introduces plugin template registration, API. I've seen on Twitter, a bunch of people who are cleverer than me in terms of code plugin developers, theme developers, getting really quite excited about this.

Just gonna read what I've highlighted. gut Gutenberg 19.1. The highlight of this release is the plugin template registration, API. It addresses a longstanding issue. Developers are faced with conflicts between plugins and themes. Particularly when dealing with custom post types, taxonomies, or virtual pages.

This new feature allows developers to register block templates directly with their new plug, with their plugins, providing fully customizable default content layouts. Till now, developers had to use multiple filters to register templates by building on the Gutenberg block system. This update makes it easier for theme and users to adapt and personalize templates according to their design and functional needs.

And then it mentions that Justin Tadlock has created a detailed tutorial, which is here, [email protected]. That was on the 29th of August. It is very long and very technical, so we won't get into that on a show like this. But, But me being me, I don't really know why this is cool. So I'm gonna hand it over to, I imagine Courtney's probably got her fingers on this.

And also maybe Mark being a, plugin developer. Can I go to you first? Courtney, do you understand why this is as cool as all the people on Twitter are saying? I. Yeah, absolutely. So Nathan, I think we're due for a hat change. I'm gonna, bring out the vintage modern tribe, visor here. And I say this because, hey, one of the hats I used to have was working at the events calendar.

[00:17:41] Courtney Robertson: And when I was at the events calendar, we were one of the first to market on having Gutenberg support for the events calendar plugin. I haven't worked for them in four and a half years, loved my time with them. but I think about, when we were dealing with creating the template for the custom post types, that's not, particularly easy for people to just modify how that template works.

So if they install a plugin that makes a custom post type or hooks into regular post types, I would imagine the ability for how you lay that out where the information displays was quite rigid. Up until, still is at this point. and what I am understanding so far of the template, API not having had time to dig into it yet, is that this will empower the plugin developers to enable folks to put the layout together in their custom post type, however they would like.

I think it's going to be a really big win, but I'll turn it over to Mark for a lot more details because I think he's probably got more ideas of how he's gonna implement it on Ws forms. Before he does that though, I'm just gonna raise this comment by Tim Nash, who, he's getting in there nicely.

[00:19:00] Nathan Wrigley: He's, following on from the comment by, Andy Palmer saying, mark, my WS form is lost in the post. Any chance can you send one? And there's another comment, which I wrote, won't raise on the screen, but it's from Nathan Wrigley and it says, dear Mark, my $20,000 has been lost in the post. Please can you, send me that as well.

Anyway, humor, I've it back here. Yeah, thanks Mark. Just drop that down please. What have we done? the plugin template registration, API says Elliot Richmond has been a long time coming, opens up huge gap, for plugin developers. So over to you, mark. funnily enough, I actually don't use custom post types in my plugin because it's all custom tables, but I still do a bit of web development on the side.

[00:19:43] Mark Westguard: I'm working on a, a website for a company right now. We're actually building them a theme so they can use that theme on multiple websites. So this is gonna be really helpful for that because we can register a template for the custom post types that we have register in that theme. for example, we've got, a post type called campus, which is, all the different campuses that this, client has.

And at the moment, it's a little bit difficult. You can do it, but you have to use a bunch of filters and stuff to, to build out the content for those templates, for those post types. So now we can just register them using these new functions, which is gonna make it a lot easier. but you can also, I was having a read through Justin's tutorial.

One of the other things I didn't realize is you can actually reach the templates for kind of custom URLs as well, which is nice. different, what I call rewrites in WordPress, you can create a template specifically for those, so it's not just limited to. so yeah, it's gonna make things a lot easier for people.

yeah, and just if you, read Justin's, tutorial, he's got some good tips in there on how to program it and make it easier to use. 'cause there, there's a, there's basically a parameter in the function where you can just dump all of the markup for the template. But he's put some suggestions in there, about loading the template file in just to make it easier to.

Great, article, but it's, yeah, not something we want to go through on this show because it's quite involved. Yeah. it's a really long one, but also, it's not the kind of code one. Yeah. Very cool. It doesn't really work in a show like this, but, I'll just quickly do a couple of other things before I hand it over to Bob if he's got anything else to say.

[00:21:26] Nathan Wrigley: Just a couple of things here. other notable changes in this Gutenberg 19.1 are improved data view extensibility, better defaults for the zoom out view, added border support for core blocks and a couple of other things. Bob, anything to say on this? I. Oh, you talking to me? Oh, yeah. I'm just, I'm just distracted by the thing on your head.

[00:21:49] Bob Dunn: I can't understand a word anybody's saying. It's a, it's an elephant sock. Okay. I went to the, I went to the local zoo and asked if the elephants had any socks available. And, okay. Yeah, no, I don't have anything else to say and I'm going to look away and, yeah. Okay. all I can say is the show is only gonna go downhill.

[00:22:08] Nathan Wrigley: You'll have less to say, as.

With a little bobble on the top, and, frankly, I think it's a good look. Yeah. I could be an oasis or something. Yeah. there's a comeback coming. Yeah. Oh boy. It's all the news over in the uk. They've, they've set up Ticketmaster to do this sort of it's a bit like surge pricing for Uber, and they've set it up and it's not Ticket Ticketmaster offer this functionality to do surge pricing.

And Oasis's organizing team have obviously implemented that. And the tickets immediately, more or less immediately went from 150 pounds up to 600. And then in some cases, 6,000 people were paying. And so there's been this big backlash, but people are still paying it. I managed to get four tickets.

I have no idea how I was Oh, for the regular price. I was up late doing programming as I usually do, you know this, it's the support tickets at ridiculous hours. And I thought, I'll have a go, And I went to Ticketmaster, it said, you're in a queue and it said you 2000th in line. And I thought, that's ridiculous.

[00:23:18] Mark Westguard: I'm never gonna get to the beginning of the queue. And then half an hour later it popped up and said, buy your tickets. And I went, okay, I'll have four. And it just went through and I thought everyone was having trouble. I think they were. And then I went back on it and it, said, you're 800000th in the queue.

Wow. Somehow I managed to get in there and got, a cheap ticket I didn't get. Wow. You could, literally, get another house for what you could sell those for. It would seem, I've, enough of this time, ell for a lot of money. Take this nonsense off. There we go. I'll bring you another one in a moment.

[00:23:52] Nathan Wrigley: okay. Thank you for that. It says, Nathan's wearing a tea. Cozy. I have no words. It's not a tea. Cozy, dress for Portland. Yes, it's gonna be chill. Courtney has a, an impressive collection of hats to one side. Yeah. I'm gonna, impressed. I'm gonna bring on That's a nice hat. I like that one. I'm gonna implement the, this is more like yours, Bob.

I feel once I've got this on, it'll look a bit like yours, a bit darker. So let's, here we go. There you go. There's barely any difference between me and Bob now. how is the ba how the band, we've, oh, we always get hijacked. Now we're onto Oasis. All right. Oasis Cast. The band is so popular, it's beyond me, says Andrew Palmer.

It is beyond me as well. They reckon, Andrew is in the paper today, that they're gonna make 400 million pounds. Next year's concerts, which is insane. Okay. Let's move on. Let's talk some more about WordPress, shall we? So this is, Anne McCarthy. She's got a website, which is called Nomad Blog, and she's requesting your help.

she wants to, to enable people to help her, test the block bindings APIs. So there's not really a lot to discuss here. I'll just quickly read through it. The block bindings API was launched in WordPress 6.5 and it's allows you, it has allowed you to bind core blocks to read from different sources without needing to write custom blocks in boilerplate in WordPress 6.5 and six, this was all done via code, but for the upcoming 6.7 work is underway to change that, to enable a ui, and it's a big change.

And so we need people to help. So that's really all I'm raising this for. If you go to nomad, do blog, search on the blog. This post was written on the 29th of August, 2024. there is a playground button. Oh, what a joy. The ability to click that button and, you get a full demo of the whole thing just by clicking that button.

And then there's some more things down here about the, the different things that you can do and how you can report various different pieces and bits. I don't suppose any of you three have anything on that. I just wanted to report that's what Anne was trying to get help with. If you do say now, and if not, I'll just, crack on.

Yeah. Just another cool feature. Yeah. Yep. Nice. Okay. alright, next one. This, this isn't all that new, because I think this happened a couple of weeks ago, in fact, I know it did, but I was, I was away. I had a little break, last week, so it never got surfaced. But this, this is to say that WordPress, opting their YouTube game and they have appointed, Jamie Marsland, he's been on the show a couple of times.

He's been on the podcast a few times and he has become, I wanna get the word right. I think it's just, I think the correct terminology is head of Word, pre head of WordPress, YouTube, or head of YouTube for WordPress or something. And his job will be to oversee the creation of high quality content, ensuring the channel remains a valuable resource and a resource, sorry.

And a source of inspiration for WordPress enthusiast worldwide. just to say this is quite an interesting stat since October, 2022. When WordPress TV began syncing their content. apparently there's been a, sorry, this I'm saying that wrong. This is since 2023, there's been a six x increase in the, engagement with the channel.

So obviously this is an increasingly important channel and, yeah, Bravo well done. Jamie, if you've watched his content, he's gone from, I think it's fair to say that a couple of years ago it was certainly a smaller audience than he's got now, and now he's got about 500 gazillion people follow.

I have no idea how many, but, last time I looked it was an eye wateringly large audience and, and it's largely to do with the fact that he's been making great content. Speed builds Gutenberg stuff, so congratulations to him and I'll throw it open. Mark Courtney, anybody Bob, wanna say anything about that?

[00:28:01] Mark Westguard: I had a quick check with Jamie about this and he's, really excited about it. I think he, is quite looking forward to. being employed and, having a regular job to be able to do something that he really loves to do and something he's very, good at. I can't think of anybody better to, do it.

So congratulations. I have no idea what you just said 'cause I was changing my book. It was all about you and your hats. Yes. It wasn't. Oh was it? Oh, damn. so what did you say? Say Mark congratulated Jamie. Okay. And says that he is doing well. Nathan is wearing a beige, it looks like perhaps crochet hat, although I don't know, my crochet and knitting.

[00:28:42] Courtney Robertson: I think this one came out, the crochet. A school of hat. it's like those old salon hats for people that got highlights where you could pull the hair through the hole. The ladies might know what I'm talking about. There's like a series of holes through this entire hat. It's wonderful. I, at the time, I'm wearing a black hat with a WordPress logo that kind of is in Boston, raised off on there.

Jamie, I think is absolutely needed for the YouTube channel. what strikes me as something to do first, Jamie's posted a few places in Facebook groups that I'm in, as well as on Twitter and a few other spots, seeking feedback from the community about what we would done with that channel. So first and foremost, I am of the school of thought that Andrea Middleton instilled in me ages ago that those who are sponsored often do the unseen work.

For those that are not sponsored to be able to flourish. So we keep the lights running, right? And and I say that because my role at GoDaddy often empowers me to contribute, and part of that is to make things better for other people who are not paid to be there. so as part of that, one of the ideas I submitted to Jamie was, a real need to focus on the SEO quality of what we already have on that channel.

So the cross posting, came about through, there was an old meta track ticket that I helped resurface to Nicholas, who was sponsored by Automatic to the marketing team. Nicholas set up a Zapier integration so that any video, which would be all WordCamp talks, but not only WordCamp talks that get uploaded to WordPress tv.

It can be cross posted to our YouTube channel, which is a fantastic win. But what still wasn't necessarily happening is all of that SEO optimization around it. So two out of four of us on this right now are, podcast hosts. I don't know how much SEO you put into YouTube, Nathan, I would guess that you skew more towards video content.

So you probably have keywords that you put in there, you probably have meta descriptions, et cetera. That's not happening right now on, the crossposting necessarily from WordPress tv. And we do have a lot of content that comes in from Learn. We only have some things that have playlists. Wouldn't it be nice if we could have the playlists from say all of the camp talks, Yeah. Word camp, whatever. And I, my most recent one was word Camp Canada. Wouldn't it be nice to have the whole playlist of Canada already organized and. In the videos, those little lovely things that the YouTubers always do of, the hover click links with the cards that send you to other parts of YouTube videos, et cetera.

Just optimizing the basics of what we already have, I think, that's really important. Of course, we're going to need fresh content and to think through that, but for so long we have just needed to maintain better handle the content that we have. Yeah, so that's really interesting. So you, what you are saying there, I've just taken that post to mean that he was going to be probably be in charge of, creating new content going forward.

[00:31:58] Nathan Wrigley: And obviously the SEO of that would be really important. Hadn't really thought about the whole, backend of things where Yeah. it would automatically consume the word camp things and Yeah. going in and just making sure that content had, like you say, those little cards so that when you pause it, it gives you options to skip.

and, also, the time is taking care of the existing teams. Yeah. The channel at the moment, if you go to, youtube.com/wordpress, it has 36 and a half thousand subscribers, which. To me seems like quite a small amount given the, importance of WordPress. So I'm guessing part of Jamie's job will be to opt that.

but there's a bunch of content in a, in different languages. There's the track from day one and day two from WordCamp Europe, but it doesn't appear to be, the individual talks as such, although I know you can get those elsewhere. And then we've got things like learn content is going on there, which we'll talk about in a moment.

And there's, there are a bunch of playlists from different parts of the world. So yeah, looks like there's quite a lot of curating and tidying up to do so maybe that's gonna be part of the job. Andrew, Bob, anything on Jamie's new appointment? Andrew, did you call me Andrew? Oh yeah, I think I did because I'm hovering over Andrew Palmer's comment here.

I apologize. despite your. Ugly hat there. Yeah. no, I, think it's great, Jamie. he's perfect for the role. I've known Jamie for, over a decade or more, and I, in fact, I think he, I was looking, he was actually on episode 20 on our podcast like five years ago. Nice. The first ones on, so no, he perfect fit.

[00:33:48] Bob Dunn: And like Courtney said, there's so many moving parts. two, just not creating content. There's so much stuff, and I think if he gets in there and manages this and yeah. Really gets things rolling. I've had a chat or two with him myself since then, and I'm excited to see where it goes. we're getting put correct, they're getting the job title description correct from Elliot.

[00:34:12] Nathan Wrigley: Thank you, Elliot. he says it's head of WordPress, YouTube, and Andrew says, this was the comment I was hovering over. Now Jamie works directly for automatic and seconded to head of wordpress.org YouTube channel. Okay, great. Thank you. And then there's a bunch of other things including, oh, that's nice.

Elliot's going for a coffee with Jamie, tomorrow, so that's lovely. So there we go. Gosh, the comments are coming in quicker than I can actually keep up with 'em. Anyway, there we go. So Jamie is very active, says Daveon, on all the WP socials and he is doing a good job in general. He's really good at creating.

Jamie. Jamie, you'll be at work m us as well. Yes. If you're going Yeah. Yeah, he's doing the I think he's doing the speed build, doesn't he again? Yeah, that's right. That's right. I can't remember who the two people are and. Is it from? Okay. I'm drawn to blank. I know, yeah. Is it, from Amber Hinz? Yeah.

[00:35:11] Courtney Robertson: Who is an equalized digital. Oh. So that would be an interesting one because obviously Amber Hines, one of the big reasons I know Amber is because of all the accessibility work that Amber does. So it'd be an interesting to watch. Brian and I don't know what Brian's credentials are in terms of accessibility, but it may be that they end up going in two, very different direction.

[00:35:33] Nathan Wrigley: maybe Brian's gonna just try to build the visuals of the site quickly, whereas Amber might be more, let's get the, accessible version going. Oh, that'll be interesting. That was, at WordCamp Europe. That was one of the, that was one of the, if you like, sellout events. Obviously once you've got your ticket, you can go anywhere.

But the, there was a bit of a standing room only for the, for the speed build, but it was on track two. So had it have been on track one, I, think it, it may even have filled that, I don't know. But it was, it was over capacity and so I, I imagine this time around they're gonna put him on track on now that he's got the, new job anyway long and the short of it is definitely seems like the right candidate, for that job.

So well done, Jamie. 'cause his content. How to describe this, you've all been to YouTube channels that are huge. And they fl around everything in WordPress, don't they? they go into commercial products, they go into plugins, themes, and I felt that Jamie's constrained it more to WordPress core and block editor content.

And because of that, it felt he really was, creating his own territory of being the, person that was talking about what, a WordPress can give you out of the box. And, and for that reason, I think, the audience has grown and he's been really good at it.

I never make content where I talk to the, I'm always on with somebody else asking them. And I imagine, I can't even imagine how difficult it must be to come up with the ideas, execute the ideas, make them interesting, and all of that when you are the only person involved. hat tip to, to Jamie for doing all of that.

That's pretty incredible. okay. we were talking about Learn a moment ago. Let's crack on with that for a little bit. this is Catherine Presna. Apologies if I got your name wrong. and I'm gonna offer this one up to Courtney fairly soon 'cause I know that Courtney's really very involved as, oh no, it's not on this website.

Saw something earlier with Courtney's name all over it. this is about, drawing new learners to the new learn wordpress.org. And I'll just read the start to kick us off now that the new Learn WordPress is out in the world. And I'll open that in a new tab and we can have a look at it. we want to have a steady flow of new learners discovering the site and taking advantage of the valuable resources it's offered.

so this post is intended to gather ideas on which recurring activities the team should prioritize first. And then if you read this article, that's the intention of me raising it. You've got until the 10th of September, to submit your ideas. For how to make it so that it's discoverable, basically, that people discover the new stuff.

And possible things might include marketing initiatives, increasing the training team's presence at Word Camps, providing learners and contributors with resources to easily promote, learn WordPress in their networks. And I think a fourth bullet point maybe could be like, what can we do with, YouTube and things like that now that we've got a dedicated, person on that team.

yeah. Courtney, over to you. Really? Okay. I need to actually write my comments here too, after the fact. I will make sure I comment on this post, which I encourage everyone else to also comment on the post. when I met Bob and Nathan, both, this is a little bit of a, throwback. It was during, I think, like a word fest during Covid, one of the first ones.

[00:38:54] Courtney Robertson: And, at the time I was teaching in a bootcamp. I. My bootcamp instructors wanted students to come out. These are adults that were retraining due to being laid off during covid. Wanted the students to be able to be, advanced tech support or entry junior dev as a result of the training. But giving them WordPress as part of their training and wanting junior devs output led to saying, oh, we need to make a theme, and for that we need PHP.

And here are the standards and the skills that the employers are saying that they need. And for lack of anything official. The bootcamp instructors did not, provide the adequate amount of resources necessary to do that because they thought, oh, you just learned to use WordPress and then you're good.

Not for a junior dev. You don't just learn to use WordPress. You learn all the languages. Even if you're front end and PHP. So when I see learn at this point and saying, how can we start reaching out? I begin thinking about my background as a vocational education teacher, career tech teacher in public schools in the us as well as in boot camps.

I've been, an adjunct professor at a community college situation. And so there is educational outreach that we could certainly do to more official organizations and unofficial like bootcamps don't really have a set standard criteria. I also think about, certainly elevating when we are at Word camps and meetups, that there is this opportunity available that materials are readily available for individual learners.

But I also would like to see some additional materials for those who are instructors. And that we really build up that pipeline of, reaching out to instructors with skills that will help people power 43% of the internet, we say, and what the job opportunity pipeline from that could look like. But I certainly think optimizing the content on YouTube as we improve the quality of the materials that we have available, unlearn, I think, tapping into some of the YouTube community around what they are finding with the video play length, et cetera, is important.

The marketing initiatives that are there, we'll get into some marketing discussion that came up recently. I do think that there is marketing that needs to be done. word of mouth marketing would be the direct outreach to educational institutions, right? That's going after educational influencers, but.

I think that, there could be a lot more done in terms of promoting it for those that would also be direct learners. And I also think that reaching out to our ecosystem and saying, do you need to level up your own staff, your own employees so that they are progressing in their career and here is a resource, could be also a good option.

[00:41:45] Nathan Wrigley: I am. I would thank you for that. That was a really in-depth comment. Thank you Courtney. Whilst you were doing that, I actually just scrolled through the new Yeah, look. Learn WordPress, which has got all of these, they're called learning pathways. and the idea really is in the future, a lot of these are spider diagram to each other, so that if you finish one, you'll be able to begin another and there'll be, a lot of cross, cross pollination between one.

You might finish the user basic one and then want to go into basic plugin development or what have you. completely free, of course, free at the point of use. Obviously not free to create, but, looks really credible. I am, I do, wonder sometimes if we're shouting into the void, obviously the audience for this podcast, they're already really into WordPress and that is clearly an audience here, isn't it?

Because you've got intermediate users and you've got advanced users, so people have been using WordPress for years, but also the beginner stuff. I wonder if there's a way of promoting that so that people are just stumbling across WordPress and getting frustrated by the UI and the ways that they can't figure out how to do things.

If that could be promoted maybe inside the dashboard. Dare I say it? okay. Right over to Mark and, Ryan. no, Bob, sorry. I was just thinking the same thing, Nathan, about pushing this more on the dashboard. I've always felt that there's more opportunity and WordPress for the onboarding process for new users.

[00:43:14] Mark Westguard: 'cause you and still word pressed and then bang, you're straight into the dashboard. It would be nice if there was an onboarding screen that, depending on your level, you could say, yeah, I'm new to this. Take me to the Learn WordPress site, and start learning about it.

I actually, I, actually watched some of these videos. I. Just to familiarize myself with 'em and they're really, well produced. Oh boy. Yeah. The content's. Yeah, the content's amazing. Yeah. really nice visuals. It's not just somebody sitting there with a cursor flashing around on the screen.

They've actually done some really nice animations and stuff to support the, learning content. yeah. I'm. With Courtney on everything that she said, we're in a tough marketplace, aren't we? Mark, as you say that, it reminds me that, in 2014, my coworker Drew Janes, led a new user experience group called KNUCKS and ux, new User Experience.

[00:44:06] Courtney Robertson: That indicated even then about pulling in materials from Learn into the dashboard. And that idea was resurrected again by Andrea Middleton. I wanna say around 2020. And for our audio listeners, again, we're switching hats. as, I, in my jaw, I guess we all switch hats a lot, but Nathan has just put on a black, I don't know, it looks like, do you remember Goofy, in Disney with the long ears where it's like the flaps of the hat go down to his shoulders.

Wing, like a long puppy dog ears and, it looks gray or black fleecy and there's a flap visor that can fold. I don't know. I appreciate all of this. Col tell me. you could just sum it up as in the word idiot, though. I think that would be quick Nathan off expedition instead of watching it, Yeah. Oh, Courtney's now putting on a, sort of beige gray magnolia, dare I say it, GoDaddy, cap, which is quite nice for those listening to this. okay. So, there we go. that's the bits on learn, unless Bob has anything. No, I, just, yeah, I totally agree. I had, three of the team members on the podcast.

[00:45:29] Bob Dunn: They were talking more about it, Nick and. Laura and Catherine. So it was a good episode. They really dove through it. Bob, our host, talked to them about it and I know I've had some conversations and we're gonna have some more conversations. 'cause I think there's a lot of opportunity and I think that piece of trying to get outside the bubble a bit too Is so important. And I've been thinking about it myself, different shows we have and how to do it and yeah, there's, I think there's ways to do it. We just have to all get a little creative and step out of the comfort zone. yeah, I think there's some, good opportunities if they get enough people involved just to, not all of us can do everything but share thoughts and stuff.

I think they could get some good stuff going. And like you said, Jamie at now doing the WordPress, the YouTube channel, it's gonna, yeah, that's huge. that's another piece to have somebody actually in control that and really thinking this through. yeah. Yeah, I'm pretty excited about it.

I think it's really, there's so much potential. So just to round that off, then, if you go to this article, it's on make WordPress dot org. It's called Drawing New Learners to the New Learn wordpress.org. And if you just scan through that, there's some ideas, about, what may happen.

[00:46:52] Nathan Wrigley: But the, feedback would be appreciated about a month from now, sorry about, sorry, eight days from now, a week from now, by the 10th of September, 2024, if you've got any ideas. because that resource is immense and it's growing and it's really professional and it deserves, a lot of attention.

I think. Let's see what some of the comments are. so Andrew Palmer is just asking, are there any share. Like buttons on the site. I'm guessing that there aren't, if you are not able to find them and you're thinking that, that would be a good idea to have, Lawrence is saying there's a ton of marketing that needs to be done, and then interestingly, Peter follows that up with any mention of marketing initiatives in air quotes may result in emotional responses from some of us.

That's, we might come to something touching on that a bit later. I can't remember if that's in the later. but Andrew likes the new design. Yep. I'm totally with you. I think it looks really credible and professional and much better than the old one. And then Michelle's joining us. Hi Michelle. Nice to have you with us.

and she's put a hat on as well, which is really nice. Why don't. Learn, simply do a simple CPT custom post out with all the other learning stuff in them. That would be awesome. Does CPT in that case mean custom post I bo I missed the Yeah, I do believe so. Okay. Andrew, I would love to hear a little bit more, I don't know if I'm understanding the, full question there.

No. Okay. so Andrew, reach out to court. I'll just put a comment in and I'm sure Courtney, you'll be able to reply to it. Alright. So there we go. Lovely. New site. And there it is. Once more. okay, so this is new. this is W-P-L-D-N, which is the WordPress London Meetup. up until now the WordPress London Meetup has been a, an evening event.

It's several hours. It's usually the last Thursday of the month. We had one, last Thursday, in fact. and we have a couple of speakers and it's done in the Central London usually, and people know where the event is, but we're stepping out the box a little bit and we're gonna try this idea of a masterclass, prior.

To the event. And so the, first iteration of this is gonna be with, sir Tim Nash, who is often on, this podcast. He, and if you've heard him on this podcast and, listen to any of the content that he's made, he's a, a WordPress security expert. And this one's gonna be entitled, unlock WordPress Security Mastery with Tim Nash.

And I'll just read quickly what it says, connect, learn, and Grow with WordPress professionals. Join the WordPress London Meetup Masterclass on October the 31st, 2024. Led by Tim Nash, a renowned WordPress security expert. Gain invaluable insights into safeguarding your client sites, elevate your agency security standards, and ensure peace of mind.

Secure your spot and become a WordPress Security Pro. And if you click on this button, you'll be able to find out more details. It's gonna be look like it says here on the 31st, so it is on Halloween, which is perfect for a security presentation if you ask me. and the idea is to turn up before 11 o'clock.

it'll finish at four. There'll be all the usual, lunch and all of that provided. And, it'll be right next to the event that the event location that we've been using so far. CL Klaviyo, which is the organization that's been sponsoring our, our venue, they're moving offices, and so they're in this kind of interim period, but the Ibis Hotel is literally next door.

It's honestly about 10 feet from the front entrance to the previous place. So if you've been there before, you should know where to go. So if you're interested in that, if you go to Wpdn UK forward slash masterclass. You can sign up, so forgive the, somewhat self-promotion, but hopefully some of you'll be interested in signing up for that.

Anybody wanna mention that or shall I just move on? I. Okay, I will move on in that case. We're back to, back to the tavern. this is just a quick one. Registrations are open for Accessibility Day, WordPress access Accessibility Day 2024. You can see the website here. You can check out the schedule and everything.

if memory serves, the schedule is now complete and published and you can see all of the different bits and pieces that are on. I won't stop, on all of the different bits and pieces, but yeah, if you want to get your ticket, you can now. Do that quick hack tip to the people organizing it this year.

The event is led by three from the board of directors. That's Amber. He who we were just mentioning, bet Hannon and Joe Dolson. But there's also been a team of eight team leads and 19 organizers. And this is interesting. I didn't realize that this was even a thing and I don't even understand it, but it sounds like there's some credentials that go along with it.

'cause it says the conference is pre-app. Pre-approved for continuing education credits for the International Association of. Accessibility professionals, web accessibility specialists, and certified professional in core competencies, certifications. So it seems that if you're, if you're into continual, professional development, you might get some, some kudos, for doing this.

Forgive me, I don't understand anything about that. Those acronyms mean nothing to me, but maybe those, that is amazing. I don't know of those particular organizations, but as a former public school teacher, I know about all of the continuing ed credits that I was required to do within a certain time period to maintain my license.

[00:52:32] Courtney Robertson: And that is absolutely amazing to be able to include current events in that. I've often thought, it'd be cool if, our flagship work camps could be included perhaps at that kind of a caliber at some point for those that need web development credits. But I. That's a conversation for another time.

have I, I'm really excited though for this. Have I judged that Right Then Courtney, is that basically an accreditation system where, you might amass a certain amount of points and therefore you can be accredited as a, let's get this right. an accessibility professional web accessibility specialist, or, that's, how I would interpret that, and it would be akin to my background as a public school teacher is what I would say.

Okay. I am not particularly versed in that organization, but, as a public school teacher, essentially things worked about the same way. That's cool. That's really nice, isn't it? That's really, nice. Just going back to what we were doing a moment ago. Oh, sorry, Bob. You've had your, you've had your head chopped off there or your body, Cheltham are about to restart in-person meet ups on the 24th of September, thanks to sponsorship from GoDaddy.

[00:53:43] Nathan Wrigley: Thank you, Courtney. Thank you. Elliot said thank you Courtney, by the way, not me. Andrew Palmer is, says he's doing, he's now doing. I am now doing the talk I did at W-P-L-D-N at Tom Bridge Wells WordPress meetup on the sixth, just in case anybody's interested. Yeah, I should say the, last iteration of WordPress London.

Last Thursday, Andrew Palmer did a talk and so did, Nowac, match check, as well. So that'll be coming to the website, the W-P-L-D-N website as soon as we've got the video all lined up. and yet why not? Let's promote the Char Meetup for anyone watching. Elliot is looking for speakers. Can I also plug that the WordPress DC Meetup Group, Washington DC just had a meeting this past week.

[00:54:31] Courtney Robertson: Tom Finley, Beth Soderberg and Tiffany Bridge are, I think the main organizers there. And it is exciting for that one to be coming back online. DC in particular has had a challenge getting venues because of how many buildings in the DC area are held by the government and they're impacted by, where can meetups and camps be held and some of those rules.

I believe this past one was the first back, and it might've been a Zoom only meeting, but it's the beginning. And that group was hundreds strong every month. Wow. As a meetup. Right before pandemic. they would get over a hundred people at their regular meetups before pandemic began. So I'm excited to see a lot of these different camps coming back online and exploring some interesting ways with it.

[00:55:25] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, it's interesting. The, I think it's steady away with, London it's, going up, but it's not like you reopen the doors and it floods back to where it once was pre pandemic. But it's definitely, as the word goes out and we continue to do the events, it's definitely, ticking on, anything Mark, Bob, about the accessibility day stuff?

[00:55:47] Mark Westguard: Yeah, one thing I wanted to say is if you are a small business and you want to sponsor WordPress Accessibility Day, you want support them, they're actually doing a micro sponsorship for it's only $150, which is incredibly cheap, to, yeah, have your logo put on their site. So if you want to support 'em, rather than just getting a ticket, get a micro PONSOR ticket, and help them out that way.

[00:56:12] Nathan Wrigley: Nice, nice. Bob. Anything? That's what I did, yeah. Yeah. Definitely worth supporting. Any way you can. Nathan's done a hat change, and this one is another black beanie type of hat with some sort of bobble on the top. It's primarily black with, there's some yellow, a little bit of maroon in there, and it's very tall.

[00:56:36] Courtney Robertson: Yeah. Surprising. And it's not home-made as the tag would indicate. Yeah. it's like never been wor look, it's still got the barcode on it. yeah, I'm still rocking my stickers on my hat. This is probably something that was bought for a child's Christmas present that never got worn. anyway, it's a nice, it's a nice little bubble hat.

[00:56:53] Nathan Wrigley: mark has, hasn't changed his hat, nor has Bob. I don't have any others. No, it's okay. It's fine. it's a gimmick and, it's not a particularly good gimmick. I shouldn't be doing it again, but I said I was gonna try and get through 'em all, so I'm gonna get through 'em all. Oh, Courtney's lining something up.

Wait for, oh, now you're talking headphones. Yeah. You're gonna have to take his headphones off. Courtney. here it comes. Here it comes. It's a nice old fashioned kind of brim hat. it looks like it's, yeah. Yeah. Very nice. All right. It's got a rim. To it. Nice little wide rim. And it's made out of, I don't know, it's woven fabric or something.

It's got a band, it's an authentic Panama hat. Oh. Which is on a company team trip to Panama. Okay. But I am wearing it very poorly as I've got, earphones on. And so it's now over the headphones. I think of all the hats I've put on so far, this is my favorite. So I'm gonna, you're gonna prize this one outta my cold, dead hands.

Moving on that bombshell. here we are. Okay. this is really interesting. and it is also not really a WordPress story, but is, this is over on the TechCrunch website, which we very rarely feature because, TechCrunch don't often get themselves involved in WordPress news.

Occasionally when there's some major security problem or something. and this is tangential to WordPress, but it's to say that Tumblr are moving. Now wait for this number. Half a billion. So 500 million. And they're calling them blogs to WordPress. I'm guessing this is the number of users they've got.

So I guess if you are a Tumblr user, you are one of those blogs with your username and password. and it says here, I'll just read it. Tumblr is making the move to WordPress after the 2019 acquisition by automatic, which they got, by the way, they got Tumblr for $3 million. Now, I dunno about you, but that seems.

Pretty cheap for half a billion accounts. now automatic will shift Tumblr backend over to WordPress. we acquired Tumblr to benefit its different strengths, not water it down. We love Tumblr's streamlined posting experience and current product direction. The posting explained this is an automation speaking, although I'm not sure who, we're not changing that.

We're not, we're talking about running tumblers backend from WordPress. You won't even notice. A difference from the outside. we're talking about one of the largest technical migrations in internet history. Some people said it was impossible. we accepted the challenge. And really, I think it's about getting it so that the automations who are running it are understand, are able to really understand how Tumblr works and that they can, I don't know, maybe make use of good snows plugins or whatever, or themes.

Maybe you'd be able to click and install a different theme. So if you're a Tumblr user, which I confess, I'm not, I don't think, don't know that I've got a Tumblr, maybe I have, I don't know. but if you're a Tumblr user, you won't notice anything. But all of the data is gonna be migrated onto WordPress. I don't know if this is gonna be the world's biggest multi-site network or how they're gonna do it.

Not sure, but it's kind of a, WordPress story, but not really, but half, half a billion, you can't even make it up. That's such a big number. Anything on that U three? Yeah, I got Bob WP blog on Tumblr. I started it and yeah, that's basically my posts on there. But, yeah, it's pretty cool because, I will know what's on WordPress even though we don't know what's on WordPress.

[01:00:37] Bob Dunn: I will know. yeah. Yeah. You'll, yeah, you'll know, but nobody else will know. It'd be interesting to see if there were, would be any like even minor little ui quirks that, you spot as a, I dunno if you use it directly, it'd be interesting to note. Yeah, it will be, because you can set, it's custom features.

You can set up your blog. A few customizations and stuff too. yeah. Yeah, it'll be interesting to see what it does. I think. I am curious to see if this brings finally block themes to using post formats. So for those that remember post formats back in the day, Matt was really interested in what, Tumblr was doing.

[01:01:19] Courtney Robertson: This was long before acquisition. He was very interested in what Tumblr was doing, with their various formats and wanting to emulate that inward press. And later we see that Tumblr was acquired and I've submitted a proposal seeking that we get post format support in 2025. I'm going to. As best as I am able to breathe with my coughing that I've got going on, as well as knowing Word Camp us is coming soon.

Try to get in there and, submit how I have configured 2025 or other default themes to use post formats and see if others can improve my slightly sloppy code. but I would love to see post formats finally come through. I enjoy them. given that you know the trend with the Fedi verse and things publish on your own site.

Always own your own content and then syndicate out. And so if I could put more into my own site, write my status messages on my own site and let that syndicate out, I would love to do that. And I think post formats could actually support that and enable it. Nathan is now onto a new hat. The top of it is, I think orangey red in this lighting.

it looks like he grew a lot of extra fur. It looks like it killed a bear. Yeah, it's the same as before with the long floppy ears down to the shoulders. but now he's got I don't know, dark roots and frosted tips for his hair. Yeah. fur that is coming out of this house. That was the look I was going for.

[01:02:58] Nathan Wrigley: Courtney. That was, you've hit the nail on the head. That was it. I thought that was just your natural hair and you're just taking a hat off. Yeah. This is what it looks like under there. It's, it's not good. I'm about halfway through. I dunno if I'm gonna be able to pull this off, but we'll keep going. so Bob, you, you, are a user of Tumblr.

And Courtney just mentioned about, like the Fed Deverse and Mastodon. I have a memory at some point in the not that distant past that you were gonna be like natively supporting the Fedi verse on your do the Woo website. Did that ever come off? Did you ever Yeah, it's actually, getting close to being done.

[01:03:32] Bob Dunn: It's been, I've had, fortunately with my partnership with wordpress.com, I have a team working on it and somebody very. Versed on it. Basically person that created activity pub. yeah, so yeah, I'm real excited about it. And we're looking at different ways to really do some unique stuff with it and.

I'm starting to wrap my brain around it a little bit more, but, yeah, that should be coming out here hopefully soon. And, yeah, we'll see whereby go and, might experiment a little bit on the side and try some new stuff. nice, I should say that Courtney is now wearing a, I don't, what does a name?

[01:04:13] Nathan Wrigley: It's another Panama hat. It's a Panama hat. Yes. This is another Panama hat. This is the one I purchased for my husband. and again, it's sitting over the headphones so it looks more special. It's a nice sandy colored Panama with a green band going around the middle. And this, is something I would be.

You are very happy to see Bob wearing, for example, our web. Maybe I'll do that. he's got like the blue version of that, hasn't he? Which is like the traditional one that we saw in the video that he made. Yeah, I have about six or seven of them. Oh, do you? Okay. Yeah. Hat, I'm sorry. Oh, it's okay. here we go.

Let's talk about the Tumblr stuff. So the exact, so Adam says the exact amount paid by automatic was never disclosed, but it was widely reported to be 3 million. Okay. so we don't know, but Adam, oh my. Gosh, wow. The valuation is significantly lower than the 1.1 billion that Yahoo paid for it earlier. It did really feel at the time, automatic had picked up something that was right in their wheelhouse, but also something that was really cheap.

But it, it doesn't feel like it, they've managed to make it work. It's not like everybody's now talking about Tumblr, to be honest. reflecting the challenges Tumblr faced in maintaining its user base and monetization strategies under previous ownership. Okay. and then Tumblr currently loses automatic $30 million a year.

yeah. Okay. That's an interesting point. So the, data and keeping it all, the lights on, that's a lot of money, isn't it? So maybe moving it over to something that they're more familiar with, IE WordPress will be, a little bit cheaper. I think that's, I think that's what this is all about is Okay, is bringing this more into the, automatic realm.

[01:05:50] Mark Westguard: Because if it's running on WordPress, they're gonna be able to maintain it much more easily than they, they probably can now. There's probably a lot of old code in there. Oh yeah. I know. They've been working towards, just generally making it more profitable. I know they've got the subscription system on Tumblr, which has started to make them an income.

there are a bunch of layoffs and, changes to people's role. I think it was at the end of 2022, I believe. So it's been an ongoing process for them to really bring Tumblr into their, own domain. sure. What's the subscription model? Is it like a, paywall for your home content? Yeah.

[01:06:23] Nathan Wrigley: You pay for, yeah. Yeah. You pay for it. I'm trying to think. there's, like a, I don't know if it's like a pro version. Okay. There's an annual or a monthly subscription. I think it removes the ads. Yeah. You can see, you can buy little, add-on things. To get more, it's like buying check marks except you're not, you're paying it to them instead of, and it's, not, anybody can get 'em, it's not whatever.

It's kind, it's. It really does look a lot like Twitter these days, doesn't it? The way that the UI is set out and everything, but, or XI should say. But, I thought it was, if you go to the blog, you what, you can do is you can buy, if you buy a certain, I don't know if it's available to everybody, I have to go back, but it's like I, I paid subscription for, I could actually create a blog.

[01:07:11] Bob Dunn: So the blog looks totally different than the UI of this type. Okay. And, the, I wondered if it was more like a substack model where you pay, into Substack to be able to see other people's content, but maybe it's not that substack, it feels that more like a medium kind of thing anyway, $3 million spent.

[01:07:32] Nathan Wrigley: Obviously it's losing them If that figure that we've been given there is correct. $30 million. So maybe as Mark said, this is a cost saving opportunity. And Lawrence quite right, it's a great opportunity to push the powered by WordPress. Type of message? absolutely. Yeah. I'm, guessing it's got a, user base that are still, using it and going for it and what have you.

So I presume from the front end it's gonna look the same, but I'm imagining the, admin's gonna change for Tumblr users, right? So they, if I go back to the article and if I can find the little bit, what did it say? da. It says here, and I'll just read it. I won't put it back on the screen. We're talking, about running Tumblr's backend on WordPress.

You won't even notice a difference from the outside. So I don't know what that means. Oh, from the outside, yeah. Yeah. Does that, that might change. That's quite a thing to put on your users though, isn't it? Half a, if you've got half a billion users and you suddenly basically say to them, here's the block editor.

Oh. as opposed to let's just keep everything the way it was. we'll wait and see. Let's find out. Yeah. Yeah. But half a billion is no minor feat, so good luck, magicians who were involved in that. Hope it goes smoothly. It goes without saying. We're over to the repository now.

Courtney, I have a recollection that you want to say something before we talked about this, article, which is all about the Yeah. A marketing consortium. So WordPress, word Camp US 2024. Contributor day is coming up. Please go register and sign up Contributor day this year. I took a lot of attention to put the tables.

[01:09:08] Courtney Robertson: Where teams that naturally will be working together would be located. did a little bit of extra digging into that. We have a couple of unique tables that are going on this year, so we don't have a few of the tables, like Tide is not particularly active at this time. We don't have any, have anyone coming from WordPress tv.

I would love to talk to people from support and also from Polly GLTs. Anyone that's willing to be, the spokesperson of those tables would be great. But additionally. Nathan, if you could look down a little bit. Fur go, ahead. Down some more. There's a spot about the different teams that are coming.

Yes. Right there. Oh. Expand. To discover each team under Contributor day teams at the bottom of your screen. Thank you. Got it? Yep. Just this bit. Yep. This year we've got BB Press, buddy press and Gather. Press having tables nice. Which will be new. the marketing team originally had planned because it is currently, experimentally paused.

We'll say The marketing team was planning on working on the WordPress showcase, but in light of the next story, there will be a meeting around 2:00 PM to discuss some of the ideas that came out of this next story. I'll just set it up for there. Okay. So 2:00 PM if you're interested in working on marketing consortium things be some, can you just reiterate 2:00 PM which time zone and what date, sorry.

2:00 PM during contributor day at Word Camp. us. Pacific Time, yes. On the Contribute Today. Thank you so much of the event. Yeah. Okay. Yep. And I can't remember which day it is to contribute today. Is it a pre or a post? I can't remember. It'll be up Tuesday. Tuesday. Thank you Bob. Yes, it will be up first.

I believe so in my head. I wanna say that this is the 17th. Okay. Is the very day of the event. And I am lead organizer, so wish me luck. Give me cough drops, and coffee. And hats. Yeah. Make sure you've got many hats. I do wear a lot. 'cause you literally will be wearing many hats in the figurative sense of the word.

[01:11:14] Nathan Wrigley: Oh, thank you for organizing that. That's amazing. The gather press one has got me interested, especially from the, from taking on some of the responsibilities for the WordPress London Meetup. Yeah. that'd be an interesting one to sit down on. I'm just trying to find it. There it is. Yeah. Gather Press is a, that day that they're hoping to, connect with the meta team.

[01:11:32] Courtney Robertson: Gather Press is aiming to hopefully replace Meetup. Yep. And right now what they need to do is get a few more details in lines so that they can have a test version of Gather Press running on the wordpress.org sites. Patricia Wt your tables around Buddy Press, bbb, press and Gather. Press are all near each other and close to meta.

[01:11:53] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. Thank you so much. okay, so that was Courtney. And by the way, I should say you, I'm looking at the WordCamp us. If you just Google WordCamp US 2024, you'll get here. And then I, use the menu commu, no, I didn't. I went to about and then contribute today. That was the menu that I did to get to here.

And you can see all of the different, please sign up. We've got lots of space, but we also wanna make sure that everyone that comes has, food and also, with the signups that would just, help us better get a headcount on how many seats to put out tables, et cetera. We, again, we've got space, but still it helps to have headcount if, if people.

So let's imagine that you are undersubscribed and people just show up. Yeah. Will they be accommodated? I can't remember where I, think it was in Athens or it might have been Porto, where many, more people than had subscribed for that day showed up and everybody was asked to basically have half as much lunch Yeah.

As they might otherwise do. Is it okay if people do show, then we're not gonna be turning them away, up to the point of the fire marshal has a code, the capacity. Okay. There's like a capacity limit. Okay. So we don't intend to turn folks away, but we would like to be good stewards with the budget and also adhere to what the.

[01:13:10] Courtney Robertson: Fire marshals say about, okay, how many bodies in the room? Okay. Yeah, that's great. and then Nomad Skateboarding. Oh, thank you. it's just put a love heart, I'm guessing in conjunction with correct Andrew. It's been some time. Hello? Yeah, that's great. and oh, Patricia, of course, heavily involved in Gather pressure, says that there's an update about Gather Press coming on the community site, soon she says, so keep your eyes peeled.

[01:13:36] Nathan Wrigley: That is a really interesting project. If you're an event organizer using me up that doesn't want to use me up. okay, so this was the article in question then. So this is Ray, from the repository. and she has. Written a piece called, is a marketing consortium, the solution for WordPress's stagnating market share.

Let's not get into the whole stagnating market share thing, but let's just imagine. That's the thing. Let's just say that's the thing. It's not, it's climbing up to 59% or anything like that. and so during a podcast recording, of the WP Product Talk, which is hosted by Matt and, Amber Hines in this case, Miriam Schwab was there and she suggested.

I'll just read it, during this week's episode of the WPE Product Talk, Miriam Schwab, head of WordPress relations at Elemental, which is obviously a gigantic WordPress property, proposed forming a marketing consortium of major WordPress companies, the goal to pull resources and develop a clear sustained marketing strategy to compete with aggressive advertising campaigns from the likes of Wix and Squarespace.

Schwab's proposal followed an analysis of marketing data, Yost Devo of Amelia Capital, shared findings, where essentially we'd got a slight stagnation two point, sorry, not 0.28% o month over month. And though this decline is within the margin of error, he says it raises concerns. So the idea here then is that a bunch of companies, big companies would get together, pull their resources, and I don't know if that means financial resources or whether that means, just almost five for the future.

It could be time, it could be money, it could be boots on the ground. It, I don't know. and, it's an interesting idea. The, I guess the concerns that some people might have is that if we have marketing led by some of the big companies, how does that get skewed, in favor of the big companies?

'cause we, we all know what that looks like. And, so there's the proposal. Courtney, I'm gonna throw it out at you first. 'cause you had the, yeah, you had the intuitions around the sort of where the link thing, where is, oh, you're going for another hat? Is she can't No, Oh. So I don't know if I, I can't really do this, so I've got two here.

[01:16:06] Courtney Robertson: I've got, GoDaddy or Page Lee GoDaddy is Page Lee. Page Lee is GoDaddy and WordPress. So I've got two hats. that was nicely done, aware to answer this one. one, marketing, it was very clear on that episode that the product owners feel that, we need to be marketing WordPress and also shared some of their concerns or ways in which they felt stifled, including mentions of the trademark and a few other things.

So it's, it becomes a challenge to say, here is my take on and I'll. Pick on mark, maybe as an example, as a product owner form plugin company. how does that help market WordPress also from a contributor perspective? WordPress hat, we have everybody that's I know how to do this in marketing or that in marketing.

And marketing is vast. Vast. And we've got people that are like, I could write good content posts, I could do social media, I should be marketing. And yes. But I would really like to tease out or hear out further the ideas that Miriam has around a consortium and what the, I never want to deny somebody the ability to contribute if they have the skills and capacity to do However, not everybody that contributes should be a core committer. Not everybody that contributes should have the keys to all the things that the meta team, our DevOps folks do, right? And so there is a little bit of, gatekeeping that goes on because we don't want just anyone shipping all the code. we don't want 43% of the web.

Suddenly, crumpling marketing takes quite a lot of ideas, and I think in the past we may have had some really good ideas, but for many voices, many opinions, things have not progressed. And we're seeing that is a significant impact that we must address and how we go about addressing that while making space for contributors of all levels.

If we want the ecosystem that depends upon WordPress to participate in the marketing of WordPress, we need to hear out what those ideas are. And I think by having a multi, not a multitude, but an audience of select voices in that conversation that would help my employer, that would help smaller plugin theme company owners know what their, I think that having, what are the needs at these different tiers, different levels, and being able to come forward and say to our project leadership, here is the request.

Here is what we're proposing. Here are the obstacles we have had in the past and here's how we can get over those obstacles. I feel like that is absolutely vital and essential. I also think that doing so in a way that is mindful for any contributor come what may that is good at some niche. Part of marketing is also important to do.

we don't want to belittle contributions where they come. We need to make space for those, but do so in a sincere way. Andrew Palmer seems to love what you're saying. Courtney, he just said, how wise is Courtney? I'm guessing that's a rhetorical question, not an actual question. He, he's got a lot of other comments as well, but we'll first go to Lawrence who says the project should dedicate 10 to 15% of resources to marketing.

[01:19:56] Nathan Wrigley: Like all companies do. It's Yeah. how though, I guess is the question, isn't it? and then Andrew's got quite a few comments. He says, Amber's comments aligned with mine. Amber, where are the comments from? Amber. Amber Hines was, part of that episode. Oh, okay. I confess I didn't catch onto what Amber had said.

Okay. Schwab also shared that no one can use the WordPress name or logo. That's what you said, Courtney, to advertise these products is that's for WordPress. That makes it difficult. If Amber's and my suggestions are taken up, the little guys will be looked after too. We just have to support WordPress funding.

And that is why Fund WP was settled with Dave Gray and I Yeah, actually that's interesting. So go and Google, I'm guessing it's been scooped up by Google by now. Go and check out Fund wp, which is a project launched by Andrew Palmer and Dave Gray. and yeah, you can see what Andrew's intuitions are there and it is a kind of.

it's not fi for the future, but it's akin to that, everybody contributes a bit and the whole system works. And then Tim, Nash, who, we mentioned earlier, he says the rivals all target specific niches. WordPress is powerful in parts because everyone can do and sometimes shouldn't do everything.

How do you market ev to everyone successfully? It seems we spend so much time chasing others and worrying about our place in the web, then why are we doing it? yeah. Okay. Bob, mark over to you if you've got anything about this marketing consortium? I, oh, I'll go ahead real quick. I think that, like anything that's happened lately in WordPress, let's not jump to any conclusions or make assumptions of when something like this conversation has first started, which is usually what happens.

[01:21:45] Bob Dunn: And let's, yeah, let's see how it plays out. Let's see what people have to say. Let's not go in and, Just make an assumption that this is going to happen this way because I think there's a gonna be a lot of talk and. I think just, yeah. Yeah. Get involved. Sit back, listen, and see where it goes. I think, Bob, I, would agree with you, just because the companies are big and they've got deep pockets, doesn't mean that they're, misaligned.

[01:22:17] Nathan Wrigley: It doesn't mean that they're gonna steer the conversation in a direction which nobody ultimately would like it. Yeah. It just means they've been successful. You never know what Yeah. You never know what they're gonna do. Yeah. you know what the ideas are and what will come out of it. So I think we need to all take a, say, Hey, this could really work out and let's get involved. Let's see what others are saying. Get in the conversation. Yeah. Yeah. Bob, one of the areas that I, I heard a need on was actually on one of your shows. I was just listening to the one that Kareem did.

[01:22:49] Courtney Robertson: recently. Talking about, it's dealing with scaling WordPress for the enterprise. And so Kareem is CEO at Crowd favorite. And of course, in that sector, the needs are why select open source versus not open source. And once you pick WordPress, or once you pick open source, why WordPress over some of the other CMSs?

Yeah. and that's just a very simplified version, but it was eye-opening to understand marketing from that sector's needs as well. Yeah. Yeah. And that's, I think that's the thing, listen to things outside the bubble, how other people are doing things, other especially open source software.

[01:23:30] Bob Dunn: Yeah, I think there's, it, is, it's massive, like Courtney said, marketing so many facets to it, and it needs to really be drilled down before we make any assumptions on how this will even play out. So yeah, I'm excited about it. I'll definitely wanna sit in on that. Contributor day and, hear what people are saying.

[01:23:53] Nathan Wrigley: Nice. Yeah. Thank you. Mark, anything before we move on? We're running fairly out of time, so very quickly if you could bring up that email of the repository, article. Again, there was a comment by Rich, rich Tabor in that, kind of resonated with me. Yes. Further down, there. No, where's it gone?

There this bit? Yeah. Yeah. And he's, he, what he's basically saying is that, there are definitely people in the community space that can help us out with marketing and product, but at the moment, you looking at a marketing funnel, we can get people to the WordPress product, but, I quite like the comment underneath, you can send twice as many people to WordPress today, but would twice as many stay.

[01:24:36] Mark Westguard: And I personally feel there's still a little bit more work to, like the learn wordpress.org is, a great example of where we're making improvements there. But getting people to the product is one thing, but getting people to use it and stick with it is another. and I wouldn't wanna see the marketing efforts, wasted, by people coming to the product and thinking, I'm finding this hard to use.

and then I just wonder about the, finances around this and h how much money you would need to dent, the, WordPress space. Because if you look at the marketing budgets of the likes of, dare I say, at Wix and other people like that, their marketing budgets are immense. we are talking hundreds of billions of dollars a month at one point.

so I wonder, where's that funding gonna come from and where's that money gonna go? Because marketing is expensive. we're an open source project, but we're a worldwide. Project, project, we're all over the place. And to market something that large takes a significant amount of re of resource to do it.

So I'll be watching the conversation on this and seeing how it goes. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. my intuitions on this is changing as we talk, which is always interesting. the idea that we, might need something like this. Do we need a sort of CMOA chief marketing officer under WordPress in the same way that we've now got a, Chief YouTube officer, if you like, with Jamie Mars.

[01:26:12] Nathan Wrigley: It's gonna be a challenge, right? Because we're an open source project. It's, we're built on the kindness gener and generosity of a lot of people. And that contribute a lot of time to it, which means on the flip side, we don't have the millions of dollars no. In there to be able to market it.

[01:26:28] Mark Westguard: So we rely a lot on word of mouth. we, rely on the pe people like you, Nathan, that, that produce WP builds and there's a lot of other community members that produce content. Adam's, offered himself up as the CMO for WordPress. There. There you go. With job Problem solved. Right?

[01:26:44] Nathan Wrigley: We've done it. It's okay. We can put that one to bed. Oh, thanks Adam. Nice one. okay, let's move on quickly 'cause I realize we are fast running out of time. okay. I'm gonna hand this one directly over to Mark, because this came out recently. It's on the WordPress developer blog and it's all about using data views to display and interact data in plugins.

And, I was just gonna raise this article and then kindly Mark interacted with our show notes for this show and he, mentioned this data kit, which [email protected]. a project by, did you say it was Z Katz from Gravity View? Z Kat? Yeah. Yeah. From, yeah. Gravity Kit. Yeah. Yeah. And then I'll also just quickly post what you have also done.

I guess off the back of data kit and data views, what's all this about? What's going on, mark? So data views is a component in WordPress that basically lets you build, different types of views, like a table view or a, like there, there's a grid view and they're gonna be using this or already using it.

[01:27:50] Mark Westguard: I believe in WordPress for things like template pages, pattern pages. Eventually I think they're gonna be using it for like post lists and pages. Oh, some pages. yeah, There's one there. Yeah. Yeah. So it's, a really nice, it's quite a simple but nice interface. I believe it's, kind of JavaScript based and, makes requests back to the server to, to get the data.

and that's been around for, I. Not more than a year. So it's been sitting there being developed. And you saw in the, latest release of, Gutenberg, they've got some more improvements coming with that. Yep. And then, so Z Katz has his team at Gravity Kit have developed data kit, which sits on top of data view basically, and, enables you to build views very, easily.

and the first version of this is you basically do it programmatically. So they've basically created some classes that you can write some PHP to build a view. And the next step of this is gonna be actually having a. A GUI interface where you can build views, which is gonna be really nice. and so they have lots of different data sources such as Gravity forms and also WS form, which is the, new one, that they've got.

So when they launch this can be gravity forms and WS form, available is data sources. So that means that any form submissions can then be displayed on the front end, using a table. but they're gonna have different views as well. for example, you could feed it a CSV file or a PHP array or, so they're basically gonna be encouraging people to build different data sources for this.

So other form plugins could do it. other, sources of tabular data will be able to be fed into data kit, and be used. this is a, this is an early mockup, so there's, a few things not working with it 'cause we're still working on it. But you can see, you can do page. Page pagination, you can search by keyword.

and, that table there could be completely customized. So you can use images, you can use text, you can put links in there, all kinds of stuff. yeah, it's quite, quite a cool new product. It's very new. I think Zach literally released it two or three days ago. so they're still waiting for the plugin to be approved in the plugin repo.

So once they do that, it'll be a lot easier to install it. but yeah, check it out. It's, this is actually gonna make it a lot easier for us 'cause we have a lot of requests for people saying, yeah, I want people to be. Submit a form and that gets added to submissions, but then I wanna show those submissions on the site.

How do I do that? This is gonna make that a lot easier. Okay. So on the example that we're looking at, it's a table and obviously somebody's submitted in a form, a photo, a name. An email address in a telephone number. And then you've got this really nice looking, encapsulation of all that is paginated.

[01:30:51] Nathan Wrigley: And you've got some settings where you can filter and sort and what have you. Yeah. That's handled by Gravity kit, data kit. Yeah, so this, that, that is the WordPress data view component right there. so the, data kit software that Zach Katz and his team have put together makes it easy to take any data source and use that data view on the front end.

That's neat. And it says at the top here, coming soon. Is this a feature that you are, obviously it's a couple of days old. I dunno what you've been doing, mark, you've had a couple of days. Frankly, it's, would've expected it to, to be out by now, but, there you go. it's coming soon, right?

[01:31:28] Mark Westguard: Yeah, it's, it is there now that sign up for updates actually goes to Zach's website 'cause I was trying to get people to sign up for it and, help him get an audience for it. But Nice. the work he's done is, great and I'm, excited to see where he takes it. That's cool. So this is, link from this article on the developer blog, which, using data views to display and interact with data plug data's in plugins.

[01:31:53] Nathan Wrigley: I'll, link to that in the show notes, but obviously I'll also be linking to the WS form piece and the data kit, as well. Yeah, data kit.org. Data kit.org. Thank you so much. Yeah, that's great. I won't dwell on this because we really are out time, but just to say if you've got WPL. WPML, which is a translation multilingual plugin on your website.

and you don't update sites regularly. Please do update that. 'cause there was a remote code execution with a CVS score of 9.9, which is, pretty critical. In fact, it's marked as critical. So just make sure you check that out. What else is there to say Apart from the onion? now this great, I dunno if you follow the Onion.

I love this website. It's just it's habitual reading for me. they've moved to WordPress and this title is so great. It says Nation Wary of Suddenly Usable Website, which I just thought was a, fabulous encapsulation of the whole thing. There was a couple of other bits, I don't think we're gonna have time to get into those to be honest.

So we will just say as we do in the uk we'll knock it on the head there if that's all right. I'm now sporting a, be. I dunno if anybody noticed, but I did a quick change there and, I did, I haven't, spoken for a bit to describe it. It looks like it is. I don't know. is it black or is it more like an olive green?

I'm going for black, frankly. I don't know. I can't tell. yeah, black. I'll go with black. And, and these are the other hats that I didn't manage to wear during the, the course. Oh my. So maybe if I just put them on whilst we wave, just put them all on. Nathan is wearing a pile of yarn in all of the colors.

There's so many on the floor already. that's it. I really have literally plumed new depths today. and this, one is sponsored by with Logos 3s. Some of them. Yes. Some of them still have tags. Some do not. Okay. We'll get rid of that little tag. And, that's it. That's all we've got time for. what, what a show it's been, I don't, putting my first one back on for our photo.

[01:33:53] Courtney Robertson: Oh, you gonna give us the final, what the heck am I doing? Trying to balance it like that and then. Maybe if I just pop that one on the top. Yeah, I can just, do that. Look at that. what the heck, Let's, there we go back to the be We'll, we'll be back, I think next week. It's not Word Camp us for a couple of weeks.

[01:34:15] Nathan Wrigley: So I'll definitely be back this time next week and then we'll be having a couple of weeks off for Word Camp us and you guys will all be there. So that'll be very exciting. That'll be really nice. But, thank you so much to Courtney Robertson, thank you so much to Mark West Guard and to Bob Don who I think I called Gary or something earlier.

[01:34:35] Bob Dunn: Doesn't matter. No, I apologize. I'll buy you a beer when I see you. Thank you for joining us. Thanks for all the comments. There was absolutely loads we didn't manage to get through them all, but we got through enough. I'm now going to collect my injured child from a forest somewhere, so we'll see you next week.

[01:34:50] Nathan Wrigley: Take it easy. Thank you so much. Bye-Bye.