264 – Automate all your workflows with Buddy Works

Interview with Maciek Palmowski, Luke Pasisz and Nathan Wrigley

So this is one of those episodes where you might learn something completely new. Buddy Works (often just called Buddy) is a great tool for saving you some real time, and who does not want more time?

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So there’s a ton of different things that you do over and over again. No matter what business you’re in, there’s always going to be repetition. Most of us specialise in something so that we can offer that skill to the market. We have done the same thing many times so that we can become an expert at something.

What you quickly realise when you’ve done something a few times is that you now know how to do. You might describe your skill level like this… “I could do that in my sleep”.

But you can’t do that in your sleep, can you… because, erm… you’re asleep! But someone, or something, else could.

Bakers don’t do all the mixing by hand, because someone invented the mixer. Soon you won’t have to do all the driving during that cross-country trip, because someone invented the self-driving car. And web professionals don’t need to all the myriad complex, dull, repetitive, time-consuming [insert your own reason here], because someone invented Buddy Works!

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Buddy Works is a tool which allows you to create complex pipelines. You’ve got a job that you feel is not really the best use of your time? Buddy Works will take that job from you and do it repeatedly. It will not get bored and complain, and you will be happier!

I will not lie to you. It’s not like Jarvis in the Avengers. You don’t get to just ‘think’, “mmm… I’m fed up with this task. Will you please take it off my hands and do it?”. You’re going to have to learn how Buddy Works works (I like that sentence)!

So, introducing Maciek Palmowski and Luke Pasisz. They’re here to explain what Buddy Works can do and how you get started.

The best way that I can describe this is… it’s like Zapier but for all the things that you might use to build websites and SaaS solutions. It connects over 130 different services so that you don’t need to learn the ins and outs of them all. You just need to know what you want to do and how to achieve that in their easy-to-use UI.

This all comes under the umbrella term of CI / CD (continuous integration, continuous delivery/deployment), and it’s more than just automation. It can do deployments, testing, converting sites to static, running backups and a lot more.

Given the complexity here, there’s little point in me trying to describe the many scenarios in which Buddy Works might save you some time. You can use the links below to explore, or, better yet, listen to the podcast to hear it!

We talk about what Buddy Works is, how it came to be, what’s on the roadmap, what you can achieve with it as well as the all important pricing.

Useful links:

You can look at how Buddy can work with WordPress:

This is their landing page related to WordPress:

Here’s an excellent overview of what can be achieved in Buddy:

This article explains how pipelines work:

there are a lot of interesting articles here as well:






Maciek’s Twitter handle:

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Transcript (if available)

These transcripts are created using software, so apologies if there are errors in them.

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[00:00:00] Nathan Wrigley: Welcome. So the WP Builds podcast, bringing you the latest news from the WordPress community. Welcome your hosts David Walmsley, and Nathan Wrigley.

Hello there. And welcome once again to the dog WP Builds podcast. This is episode number 264 in titled automate all your workflows with body works. It was published on Thursday, the 3rd of February, 2022, my name's Nathan Wrigley. And in a few minutes time, I will introduce you to Machek and Luke, so that we can chat about body works.

But before then a very small amount of. If you like what we're doing over at WP Builds, I would very much like you to share that, feel free to share whatever you like, wherever you like. It could be a particular episode, or it could be just the URL. WP Builds.com go around, share it. Tell all of your friends who were interested in WordPress, we'd be most grateful.

It always helps to get a five star review on something like apple podcasts. So whatever you feel that you can do, we'd be most. Another thing to do might be to go to WP build's dot com forward slash subscribe. And over there, you can fill out a form and we'll keep you updated. When we produce new content, it's got things like our Twitter feed, URL and YouTube URL and so on and so forth.

So that's WP Builds.com forward slash subscribe. I always mentioned at the top of the show, our deals page WP Builds.com forward slash deals. That's a bit like black Friday. Every single day of the week, there's loads of offers on there, significant amounts of WordPress related products. So hosting themes, plugins blocks, all of that kind of stuff.

WP Builds.com forward slash. And last, but by no means, least WP Builds.social. And I keep saying yes, that is a URL. WP Builds.social. It's our mastered on install, which is a bit like Twitter, but open source. If you'd like to join us over there, it's fairly quiet at the moment, but you never know if you're fed up with being on social media and being followed around the internet.

The master on install might be. Okay, let's get stuck into the main event today. This is episode 2 64, automate all your workflows with Buddy Works because I'm joined by Matt cheque and Luke from body works. And they're going to tell us what their service does. If you've ever used something like Zapier.

Then, roughly what this episode is going to be about, the idea is that you have a service and you'd like to connect it to another service, or you'd like to automate something within a particular service that you find time consuming. Perhaps you find it dull or simply repetitive. And you want to offload that task to some automation software.

That's what Buddy Works works does, but rather than being on the sort of consumer. Things like Zapier is it's much more to do with web development and web design. So WordPress fits very neatly into that. It can do an awful lot of complicated things. So I think it can extra about 130 different services, many of which you'll have heard of some of which you may not have done.

And it will. All the tasks for you. The complexity could be incredible. The time-savings could be incredible. You've just got to figure out how it all connects together. They've got a fabulous UI, but there's a lot of complexity in here. And the guys today are going to explain how bodywork works and what it can do for you.

I hope that you enjoy the podcast. Hello, welcome to the WP Builds podcast. You've got to an interview episode today and really unusually. In fact, I cannot remember the last time I was interviewing two people on one episode, but that is in fact, what's happening today. We have with us today, Matt check, and we have.

And they're both from body works. I'm going to ask you as I often do before the episode begins. If anything, during this episode, it doesn't make sense. If anything, during this episode is confusing to you. Just hit pause and go to body. B U D D Y works, W O R K S. Check it out over there and then come back and hit play.

And you may be slightly less confused. So first of all, hello there, Matt check.

[00:04:22] Maciek Palmowski: Hi, great. It's rainy and the weather is horrible, but apart from that, it's really

[00:04:29] Nathan Wrigley: great. Oh, you, in the world that the weather is.

[00:04:32] Maciek Palmowski: I'm in the center of Poland in the city called, which, which means both city, which is funny because we don't have access to any sea or anything.

And it's just the part boring origin story. Yes. I live in both city and I think the only water weather that we have now, It comes from the

[00:04:55] Nathan Wrigley: sky. Yeah, they got good. We living in the UK are well experienced with rain and I should also introduce us to Luke. How are you doing Luke? And where are you in?

[00:05:06] Luke Pasisz: Hi, doing fine. I'm based also in Poland and Cracko, I am happy that we did start the Polish way. So a bit of complaining my check. Good for us, for sure.

[00:05:17] Nathan Wrigley: Polished

[00:05:17] Luke Pasisz: now. You have to counterpoint your yes, actually. Yeah.

[00:05:24] Nathan Wrigley: A again, this is a typically British trait is to complain and moan about things.

So honestly, this is going to be a great episode. We're going to talk about the weather and we're going to complain. No, we're not. We're going to talk about body works because both Maciek and Luke have have come on the podcast to talk about this. Like I said, if you'd been to the URL and browse around a little bit, you would have had some insight into what it is.

It's all about CGI CD and. Those acronyms may not mean anything to you. You guys, you can interrupt each other as much as you like, or you could hand it over to one another and say, Luke, you handled that or much at you handle that. But I am just going to simply ask what is body works? What does it do?

[00:06:06] Maciek Palmowski: Okay.

Like you mentioned buddy is a CICB platform and like you also said, Probably most people don't have a clue. What does those acronyms mean? First of all the CD in it doesn't mean come back to record. Yes,

That's true. So CACD stands for continuous integration and continuous deployment or development. And in simple terms, it just means it's that way. We can, it's a philosophy of developing software when we just test every time at every step. And we try to automate as much as possible.

[00:06:57] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. So with the platform itself, Y I would imagine that most people listening to this podcast, there's a great crowd of us who we communicate with clients directly.

We onboard those clients, and then we build them a website. It's very much a sort of freelancer thing, but also we've got the, we've got the agency crowd who listened to this as well. People who are working on significantly bigger projects, and they've got a great big team. I wondering if you could address the concern of why would you need to do this?

What's wrong with the way that we've always done things where we, we hand around jobs to our team and we, we develop things and we decide that it's going to be fine. And we talk to the client and they look at a staging server and once that's all done and everything's happy, we hand it over and we signed the documents to say, it's all finished.

Why do we need to do things continuously? What's the imperative.

[00:07:51] Maciek Palmowski: If we are developing a website that needs quite often updates for some reason, because it's evolving quickly and. Then it's a great place to implement the CACD because when we develop something quickly, we don't want to waste our time on constantly.

Checking did our previous fix didn't broke anything at some other place. That's why thanks to CACD and The part where when we have to write some tests on our end, we can make sure that our website will work correctly. Even if we constantly do some updates in the code, we will change stuff. Then we will be sure.

Our new features won't break anything from the path.

[00:08:47] Luke Pasisz: Yep. So what matric essentially says is that you by means of, CACD the concept itself and automation you simply, at the end of the day, you can get pretty much predictable results of.

[00:09:04] Nathan Wrigley: Okay okay. Let's say, imagine a scenario where I am either sold or I'm working for an agency or something like that.

I'm imagining that everything that you do, because the truth is almost every business on earth can be replicated, but I'm imagining that the offer that you've got is you're taking. A really difficult to achieve thing and wrapping it up in a SAS platform, which is straightforward to use it.

Is that basically what you're doing could be done by any individual, but you're making this terribly difficult thing, much more straightforward.

[00:09:41] Maciek Palmowski: I would say, yes, this is this a really great grid point because first of all, we are not the only CICT solution out there on the other hand. Most of those tasks can be done on our computers by each developer and so on, but thanks to the thanks to body we can, first of all, It's so much easier to do it's in one central point.

So every developer will have the same platform. So the results will be the same when we push some change and we don't have this typical developer problem, it worked on our, on my machine and And yes this is buddy. Mostly makes it easier. It's like I said, it's, it could be done on other platform.

It can be done on developer's computer, but it will be much more difficult. We had to remember about doing those step-by-steps every time and with thanks to using a body, we just push our changes into into our get repository. And all the things run automatically.

[00:10:58] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. The, I want to get this bit out of the way first and the, obviously this is a WordPress based podcast and we'll talk about the specifics of WordPress and how you accommodate WordPress.

But I do want to draw attention to the fact that really you're everything to all people. Aren't you, it's not just about WordPress. And so just very briefly because many of the people will be listening to this exclusively using WordPress. And there'll be a whole host of people as well. Who are you?

A bunch of other technologies and connecting it to different platforms. And what have you, w is there any sort of specific use case outside of WordPress, any service that you connect to, any kind of integration that you just want to mention? In other words, tell us about the outside of WordPress stuff that you do as well.

[00:11:44] Maciek Palmowski: Look, maybe it's your turn for this,

[00:11:47] Luke Pasisz: right? I would say that, WordPress is just a part of what we do on what we do have covered with with body, with this platform, because essentially what we do is we lower the entry point to the processes that much you mentioned in not merely in the context of WordPress, but I would say the whole web stack that is out there.

So we are talking about. Web technologies, web, programming languages, say Peyton, all the PHP, all the JavaScript and related frameworks embody you can easily automate the processes that are pretty much, I would say, intricate and At some point would require from the user certain DevOps knowledge by means of really dry, easy drag and drop steps and through graphical user interface.

So there is, I would say there is no limit. I would say that we can, we are only restricted by user's imagination, right? W what you need in order to automate and body is I would say a working computer operating system and Lego pieces, understanding and that's because the process is that simple.

So it's hard to pinpoint certain gravity point that would that would pretty much encapsulate, What's Darren the platform because we have more than 130 actions that are integration driven. Yeah.

[00:13:42] Nathan Wrigley: So looking at your your homepage at the minute, and I see all these logos flying by and essentially every kind of technology that you could come, you could imagine on the website.

S3 PHP, Python, Heroku. Oh my goodness. It just never stopped.

[00:13:58] Luke Pasisz: And we are also, yeah. And we, now we are also opening up to two mobile developers communities because they're also big. And I do understand that it's essentially, the. Did he remarried of our podcast, these are also like business wise, by the way, I'm the business guy in the company also are areas that we either have covered or developing a platform and those directions and yeah Hard to pinpoint one thing, but essentially I would say when you juxtapose us similar, tools that are out there and they are really great tools and in that respect, and I would, I would strongly recommend checking them out psycho, CIA, Travis Jenkins, which is more tricky, more difficult.

I say, But the easiness of use is the main differentiator I would say, and think that I would emphasize strongly. Why we are here, and why magic works as WordPress ambassador at body. I don't want this podcast to end up as a commercial, so I know if we can punch in this direction but we believe that buddy is as so easy that you can utilize the tool as a learning platform for the whole CACD automation.

So I would, yeah, it's really worth investing your time. To in, in CIC, in automation,

[00:15:37] Nathan Wrigley: one of the, one of the things that immediately sprung into my head when I saw body works for the first time, and I have to confess the first time I saw it, it was when you guys had reached out to me, because as I said to you, before we clicked record this is just not an area where I'm personally getting involved.

But it felt almost Zapier, that platform, which allows you to connect all these different things. And sure enough, if you sat there and you hammered away and really spent a long time developing solutions, you could connect your, I don't know, your WordPress form solution to Google drive and all of that could be done by you.

But if you. Look at Zapier and click a few buttons and drag some things into some boxes and click around a little while. It'll do it for you. And it feels a little bit like body works. Is that for building anything on anything without it failing and keeping your team all up to date? Yeah,

[00:16:32] Maciek Palmowski: exactly. Yes. And also it's probably quite easy to integrate Zapier with body because they have web hooks so we could connect it.

For example, I played with connecting body with IFT. Every time I had a successful deployment Spotify open and played eye of the tiger

[00:17:01] Nathan Wrigley: genius. Oh, that's so good. So

[00:17:04] Maciek Palmowski: yeah, this is this is the part that, that look mentioned about that only the imagination is stopping us at some point, because with all those great tools out there we can really connect not only. The things that we want, not only the deployments, but we get connected to the real world because why not?

[00:17:29] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. So you said one of you said a moment ago that you didn't want this to turn into a commercial, but it's okay. Let's, we've got to talk about the product in order to discuss it. So let's deal with specifically with the word press side of things, and for anybody who let's take the example of somebody who is.

Fairly seasoned with using WordPress, but they typically go into their hosting company. Maybe they've got a managed WordPress solution or something like that. And they press a button and up pops, WordPress, and they fiddle with that. And then they play with it until the client's happy. And then they just hand it over.

What is the use case? Why would somebody ever want to spend their time investigating body? What is it that you do that on the WordPress side that makes their life.

[00:18:15] Maciek Palmowski: Okay. So the first thing would be that this person would like to first learn a bit about version control system, for example, get, because this is the foundation on the wage.

The whole CICT works. So without the version control it just won't work. So maybe first, maybe a few words about about before. Get is nothing else, like a long log of all our actions we did in our code. So every time we do a change. We save it into the get repository. And at any point we can either go back to, to see how some files changed.

We can see who made, which change and stuff like this. We can also create branches so we can like work on few things. At the same time. This is really great when we have more developers. But like I said, this is our central log of all dangers in our code. So if the developer at some point realized that yes, it will be easier for him or for her to start using, get to.

To have this whole history of changes. Like I said, it's really great when we are starting to work with with some extra developers or we have a whole team. And so if we have this, the first step we could do is just automate the deployment. So for example, every time we make a change to some of our files, It will automatically be pushed to production.

We don't have to open our file Zillow or any other FTP client. It will just happen in the background because we can set in body that every time that there is a change in any of our files in the repository, we push everything to print. And this is the most simple case. There can be, we can do the same on staging and on production, but that's all, it's just moving files from From our repository into an, into that, into the production.

At some point, probably this developer will also start learning about some new technologies like using all those devil script libraries with NPM or some PHP libraries with composer because this is a natural. Of of many developers learn, they start with just with a simple WordPress and they start to learn new things.

And these are the things that will have to insult or run every time before deploying. So we can add one more step in our deployment pipeline. So every time we change something in our repository, we will. Run all those scripts we need. And then we push all the results to production and we don't have to worry about remembering to run some extra tasks.

So this would be the first steps of our of our developer that would like to automate some of his work because let's be honest, developers are lazy. I know because I am a developer too. Yes. And. One of the things we love about automation is the fact we don't have to remember about things. We just set it up once and it happens somewhere in the background.

We don't have to worry about it. If something goes wrong during the deployment, we will get a notification that something went wrong, but we don't have to constantly look at our, for example, fights Lila to see if all the files went. Because a body will inform us if something went wrong and if not, we just don't have to even care about that.

Suffering happened. We just pushed the the things to production now.

[00:22:38] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah okay. So the intention is, and again, I think the Zapier metaphor works the idea is that you set up in your case the simplest one would be connect to get repository to the live environment and do things over and get, and it all gets pushed to live.

And you simply. Need to think. The only point you need to think is if something goes wrong and we'll talk about that in a minute, about how it notifies you and so on, but the what's the interface for this then. Those who are familiar with things like Zapier or IFT, TT will know how that works.

It's very much a sort of UI. Drag things you push things around, you fill in check boxes and what have you. I am imagining that you have got what I know, because I've looked at the website, but describe how you build this kind of stuff, because obviously you want to strip away the complexity.

And so the UI that you've got has to be intuitive. Maybe if you just walk us through that straightforward, simple example of connecting get, and then going live to production and so on. How do you actually do it?

[00:23:49] Maciek Palmowski: So when we have our ripples. We go to our website. First, we just connect our repository by selecting clean from our from the list of all repositories we have on our account, because we can connect them.

Then body will automatically download all the files from the repository into our file system because it's. It's something like an internal cash, but we don't have to dive into this more then. We will have a screen with one big button to create your first pipeline. In this first pipeline, we will select an action, probably FTP or SFTP.

We will just add credentials to our tower. It will be also a good thing to select which files we don't want to push, because for example, we don't want to push the folder with node modules or something like this. It's up to us and that's all we just can click then this button like run pipeline. It will just

[00:25:00] Nathan Wrigley: run.

So the pipeline is the sort of rapper term for all the things that you're doing. And you can then drag a whole bunch of other things into the pipeline. And obviously the more that you drug into the pipeline, the more complex the scenario is, and the more things that can do it can do. So you've given us.

A very basic one. Tell us about some of the sort of hidden goodies that our typical WordPress user might want to be dragging into their pipeline and modifying you. You can optimize things in body boss. So for example, you'll take care of minifying the JavaScript and so on, and also do things like compressing images, which really extraordinary.

So tell us about some of those.

[00:25:47] Maciek Palmowski: So yes, first of all we can we have some optimization tools and we have some testing tools, which are also quite interesting. You mentioned the magnification of images and this is a cool feature, but in terms of workers, it won't work as good because it will only optimize the images we have in our repository and not the images we have.

On, on the whole website because it's in the WP content folder. But I would say those those tests actions are really interesting. For example, we have Google lighthouse score. So we can add a step in which. Test if our over lighthouse score didn't drop because of our changes.

And if it did, maybe we should either just notify developers with a warning or maybe stopped that the deployment, because obviously we did something wrong. And currently this is something very important because we know how Google looks at the websites. So this is the thing that a real lot of developers shoot out into their pipelines.

We have a great action to compare how the website looked before and after the deployment.

[00:27:21] Luke Pasisz: So we can double for WordPress developers.

[00:27:24] Maciek Palmowski: Yes. Yeah. So we can, for example, have a list of the most important websites we have. What pages we have to check if nothing. Nothing broke after our small change.

That should not break anything, but we know how it happens. We know how it happens. Yeah. It's this small little change that just had to make our font a bit bigger, destroyed the whole website. It happens. And thanks to this visual comparison section. We can see it. And when we see that something went wrong again, we can stop the deployment, which is great because we don't want to push something like this on production.

I would also say there is a very useful action for clearing cleaning cloud for cloud clerk cash, because manually developers are using councilor and it will be great that after. Deploying some changes. We would automatically clear the cash without having to go into copper. And it's easy.

We just select an action connected with our accountant. Everything will happen in the background. So those are the actions that comes to my head from when we talk about those simple ones. But of course we can. I can start adding all those tests because we can, but this is something from our experience developers, there are so many ways we can test our code and that will probably add those steps also before deploying it to production.

[00:29:08] Nathan Wrigley: I want to draw attention to. The pricing page and actually not for the purposes of pricing in this case, although we'll come to that a little bit later, so this is body.works forward slash pricing because it's actually the pricing and features page. They're both wrapped up in the same page there, and you'll get a real sense by looking at that page.

Th the sort of level that you can go to because you've got a list of the sort of different product pipelines that you can add. And obviously, it's a pricing table. So if some things are included on certain tiers and what have you, but the range and the depth and the amount of different things that you.

Is extraordinary. There is so much in there. It's it's almost too much to take it out. There's a lot in that. So when you said a minute ago that the sky is the limit on a podcast like this it's going to be almost impossible to describe the unique, crazy, interesting things that you could get up to.

But if you do just pause, go to body.works forward slash pricing and have a look around on that. Very quickly get an understanding of exactly what's possible because it's hundreds of different things. I think you said 130 things and they range and growing and they are, we would always on a weekly basis.

That's one of the UVP is on your website. Isn't it? That you update these things all the time as well. So yeah, the go and have a look at that page and you'll, you will be staggered at what is there with that. How long have you guys how long has body work's been around?

[00:30:49] Luke Pasisz: We've been around since end of 2015 and 2016.

Okay. So a couple of years now. Yep. Yep. Yep. It's still bootstrapping. And yeah. Doing well. Making ends meet. Yeah.

[00:31:04] Nathan Wrigley: Now w one of the things that would, what are the things that are. Basically, if you were trying to get me over the barrier of signing up for this, first of all, I'd need to know that there was going to be some benefit and hopefully during the last 20 minutes or so you've described scenarios where people think, yeah, actually I can see that I would make use of that, but the second hurdle that I would need to get over would be education.

I would need to, I would need to be guided through this process because. All right. It's you guys are developing it and it's probably second nature to you and you'd watch somebody like me using it. You'd be totting and going, oh my God, why doesn't he just, but I would need to know that you were there to help me to allow me to learn the platform that there were tutorials and assistance and support and all of that.

So can you speak to us about guidance and help that you provide to make the platform more usable than if we were just told there it is. Get on with.

[00:32:02] Maciek Palmowski: Maybe I will start with with my journey because I was like client of body too. And I remember that buddy was one of my first CIC platforms ever. So I remember that I tried also get lab, get her actions and stuff like this.

And I had problems using it, just like this. It was too complicated. There was a lot of problems. And then I signed up to buddy and everything was just so simple, just like that. The goodness is that for, did I think that for developers, with even the basic understanding of of Linux of CLI and.

Buddy's should not cause any problems. And. It would be so easy to understand for them. But you mentioned that as you mentioned, not everyone is a developer and and here, this is something that we are constantly building. We are still adding more and more more guides we are trying to to do more.

More webinars. We are showing different scenarios how you can use body. For example, we had the chance to that to show how to create static websites together with strandic. We had a great webinar together with Ken stop on, on creating the perfect deployment flow. And currently we are working on that webinar about using, get updated with the fragrance.

Yeah. Even this, you can see Coco many scenarios. There are, and there are much more and plant already. But yeah, this is something that we will be still constantly work on. We will try to add more and more guides tutorials, just to make it easier for everyone to start their advent. Do you,

[00:34:09] Nathan Wrigley: Do you offer support within the platform?

So for example, do you have like chat support? If I bang my head against something and it doesn't work or is it an email-based system or, yeah, what's going on dedicated

[00:34:21] Luke Pasisz: support. That works pretty much 24 7. Obviously there are some, basic SLS under that, but. But if it should, should any user have issues with the platform we usually answer within one hour.

And for that purposes, I hope that I may drop names of other companies. We use Intercom and it works well. So a great group of dedicated people that handles their support. And we do not differentiate. So if you come to us with your free plan or you are, a big enterprise customer.

Because we operate within the scope. We are, from SMBs up to government agencies and really big enterprise businesses. We try to be as flexible as possible and answer within this was one hour. But as much mentioned, and Nathan, I really dig this Zapier or is it.

I don't know how you pronounce it either is fine. Yeah. Natural for us to say up here, because it samples other Polish word, which is vulgar with. But but that's not the reason that I did this comparison. I would say that, because. Yeah. Obviously there has to be a certain level of knowledge.

You have to, at least when you start using tools and you say invest time in being WordPress developer, you know what you are aiming least, or what your results at the end of the day should be. So in body that the steps that. That are to be designed by a developer by the user are so intuitive that th the entry point is lower to now.

I would say to the. And at the same time, the tool is robust enough to grow as you, experience automation as you get more and more experienced within the whole CIC, the concept. And that's the feedback we've been getting from our customers by the way that they can just, open the body account to a new biz newcomer, junior guys, and they start learning.

With the tool. So it's also, I do believe that to a certain extent, we democratize the whole dev ops space, which is difficult to approach for for a developer, for people that are starting really high level with, for example, CMS systems or are really like, are using lightweight JavaScript technologies.

I do hope it doesn't sound boastful that there's no entry point is reduced to zero, but yeah, it's, I guess it's worth a try to see for yourself because obviously we are talking with a certain context, and we've seen the platform. We are developing body by means of body. So maybe.

We like this distance. I know

[00:37:58] Nathan Wrigley: they the, some of the sort of screenshots that I'm looking at really do bring that home. You basically click on things and then other options appear which work, which would be compatible with those things. And then you can. Those things and then fill in the details for those things.

And then other things emerge because of what you did just then. And essentially it's like a linear structure. You start at the top, work your way down. And by the time you've reached the bottom, hopefully everything is working. Do you have any of these pipelines pre-built out, typical ones that people are using all the time.

Can you, rather than having to build certain things, do you have ones that you can just say, actually that sounds perfect. Let's just click a button and then connect the dots and it.

[00:38:42] Luke Pasisz: You've nailed it because we are working on that where working contempt place that will that will allow our users or newcomers to the platform kickoff easier.

But I would say the configuration usually takes play takes five minutes time. Yup. Am I correct? Yes, I think

[00:39:01] Maciek Palmowski: Because this is this was the thing about which we were we were talking internally about creating documentation for, we were talking mostly about those was JavaScript JavaScripts static site generators, and we realized how similar all those would be because they're mostly need two actions.

First is for. Building decide, which is normally something like run the command called NPM run build. And the second action would be to deploy to the place where we're, where we want. So it can be either our our server, or it can be for example, Natalie firearm or place. That's all the, these are two actions.

And the only thing that can change as for example, where do we want to deploy it?

[00:39:56] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Yeah, I get it. So that it's

[00:39:58] Luke Pasisz: as easy as, making Cassandra, which essentially is the question, whether. What do you wish to, have your own sound, which are done by someone

[00:40:09] Nathan Wrigley: it's easy to decide what the feeling is going to be in and then go to the one of the things that I'm curious about is whether or not there's an option.

Obviously, you would love from the result of this podcast, that many people came knocking on your door and said, can I give this a go this is intriguing to me. I've never played with this before. I'd like to give it a go. And do you have options for people to just play around for a while, maybe a free tier or something like that we have

[00:40:37] Luke Pasisz: that is free forever and pretty much would cover your daily freelancers work.

And then if you want to go pro we have this problem that starts at a certain level, but for the learning experience and for understanding the whole concept itself, the concept behind the platform and other part for all platforms. And the whole CACD concept, right? I would say the free plan would be a way to go and a place to start with or start from.

And you can stay forever on free plan by the way.

[00:41:16] Nathan Wrigley: So I'm looking at the pricing page that I mentioned earlier, you've already had the URL. So the free plan is obviously it costs no dollars per month. You're constrained to five projects, 120 of the pipeline runs per month, 512 megabytes, cash storage, a gigabyte of Ram, two CPU's and so on and so forth.

And then we've got different options beyond there. If, you've played with that and you fail, actually, this is saving me a bucket load of time, and I'm really enjoying this. You've got a pro plan, $75 a month, 20 projects. And all the other figures that I just mentioned are bigger and then hyper plan $200 per month again.

But at this point we're on to unlimited projects. So if you're an agency, this feels like squarely where you'd be at most agency go for the hyper one. Unlimited pipeline runs basically a boatload more thrown in, and then there's curious on-premise solution. What's that about

[00:42:09] Luke Pasisz: on premise solution is just Justice quote unquote, right?

It's the enterprise version body, because when you are developing solutions like body and you are providing them to bigger and bigger players, as you proceed up the market from the. I did mention the SMB segment, right? And when you start growing, you go into more corporate world, the compliance matters.

Start to kick in all the security aspects and certain customers just wish to have buddy installed on their own infrastructure. So in that respect, And pricing is a bit different because it's based on the number of seats, right? So you pay for the seat and and usually it's a plan. Majority of our customers are cloud driven.

They opt from for either free. Prior to hyper plans. The on premises are for the biggest players out there, or the ones that, that really need to have everything behind, behind their own firewall.

[00:43:23] Nathan Wrigley: Got it. So it's your enterprise? The enterprise. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So if you're, if you outgrow the hyper plan, you've got the option to look at the enterprise on premises.

We can always

[00:43:34] Luke Pasisz: Sue you because there's we try to be. And I do believe that we are as flexible as possible. So if you were opting for something aching to pro plan, but still not hyper, just get in touch with us on support and our customers do it, and then we figure out the best solutions for them say same number of projects as in pro plan, but maybe a more Castile.

Yeah, yeah. I've also seen because we are now currently on a daily basis used by tens of thousands of developers. We are talking around 2000 companies all together, so it's got quite a lot and I've seen also plant your freelancers going from free plan to pro plan because they have more projects to cover in a certain month.

And then coming back to the free plan for the The work and it's still fine with us.

[00:44:35] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Yeah. It's like anything. If you go and have a play around and you fail, it's going to save you some time. Then the money's well spent the the, one of the things that I always ask, because everybody always tells me, can you, why didn't you ask them?

This is what's coming down the roadmap on the roadmap. I should say. You mentioned that you're adding new things every week, and I know. The information that you give me now, we'll obviously go stale, but just for the people who are listening to this episode right off the bat you got an insight into some exciting new things coming towards the end of 2021.

[00:45:10] Luke Pasisz: So currently we will be opening up to iOS developers, community, and we are. In the process of better testing of these new features. From this business perspective, I would gladly see us closing 2021 with a nice share of our customers using those features. And also much I guess what's worth mentioning here are dynamically created staging environment.

[00:45:41] Maciek Palmowski: Yes. That's so it's sandboxes, how's it? Call it. And this is one of my favorites because this is this is a really cool part of working here. I have access to some stuff that is the publicly available and some boxes are really cool. We can just create our own staging server in a matter of minutes, seconds.

And it will be working. We can run it. We can do some tests on it and whether we don't need it, we just close it. And. Run it again when we will need it. So this is one of to be honest, this is one of my favorite features and I really can't wait when it will go. Oh,

[00:46:27] Nathan Wrigley: that is nice. Yeah, that's really nice.

So quite a lot coming up, obviously there's a lot there. I feel that on a 40 minute podcast, we really can't. Do justice to what it is that is possible. But again, just drawing parallels to what Zapier can do. You imagine the literally millions of possible combinations of things that you could do on the Zapier side, connecting SAS products to other SAS products on the web development side of things.

It really feels like body is able to do that. Your very best way of doing that is to go check it out, buddy.works. And as said, If you want to go and check that out we didn't mention, you did mention that there was webinars that you were putting together, but we didn't mention the URL for that. So just upend webinars to buddy.works.

So buddy.works forward slash webinars, and you'll be able to go and check those out. And it sounds like there's a lot of those coming. From my part, I think I've asked all of the questions that I wish to ask, but I also want to give you an opportunity in case. Horrendously missed anything. I'm just going to ask you one at a time.

So we'll go for my check to start with anything that we missed, that you wish we had.

[00:47:38] Maciek Palmowski: No. I think that we would, that we covered, we have covered everything. I really loved the does Zapier at barrel because this is something that really greatly describes us. And it's also a one more metaphor that I can use because when I do some webinars, I always either attend.

Call it a Lego blogs are when I go forward to WordPress community, I say it's something like Gutenberg slash Elementor for CACD. And here we can also go with the Zapier metaphors. So

[00:48:13] Nathan Wrigley: it's the first time finishing a podcast where somebody's ever learnt anything from me. So really great.

And and.

[00:48:22] Luke Pasisz: I'm good. Okay. It's been really worthwhile. I hope the listeners will with very episode, and we'll see each other when. New events from the WordPress community will pop up and start after this point

[00:48:45] Nathan Wrigley: time. We want those so badly. Yeah. Again, just before we go, just another thing just occur to me, which is gonna ask another question.

I have a few friends who are in inverted. Experts at Zapier, they've got to the point where they are so ludicrously good at using it, that they have made a business out of Zapier. In other words, you go to them and say, I would like to achieve these things. And I can't be bothered to figure it out, or I don't have the expertise to figure it out.

Please, will you do that for me? And I wondered if you had any plans for that kind of thing, body works experts, marketplace or anything.

[00:49:27] Luke Pasisz: I would say it's a. It's part of already existing and business plan, because we do have companies that started using us. And I don't know if we could call them body experts, but by all means DevOps or automation, experts that are utilizing body for the sake of their own customers.

But surely this is. Something worth worth implementing body champions.

[00:49:58] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Yeah. There you go, buddy champions. Yeah. Perfect. Okay. Literally the last thing I'm going to ask is there a better place to reach both of you? Should people be interested in speaking to you personally, that could be an email address or Twitter handle, or maybe you don't want to share any of that and you want to be left well alone, but we'll go for my check first.

Where can we connect?

[00:50:19] Maciek Palmowski: The best way would be to find me on Twitter. And my handle is I hope that it will be rubbed it down because okay. Bothering me dash FP and this is the best way to contact me. I have always, I have my direct messages open. Like I said, this is the best place you can tell us.

Ask me about anything related with with WordPress, with TICD. And I really always love to, to answer

[00:50:52] Nathan Wrigley: things like that. If, and Luke

[00:50:54] Luke Pasisz: and myself, I'm available obviously on LinkedIn being the old school guy. And also you can catch me on Luke. This is easy. Look at Buddy Works.

[00:51:06] Nathan Wrigley: Lovely. Thank you very much.

We've gone over time, but I think it was very well worth it. I really appreciate you talking to us today. Certainly teaching me an awful lot and getting me into something new that I haven't really spoken about before. Go check out. Buddy Works contact the guys if you've got any questions and thank you for being on the podcast today.

I really appreciate.

I hope that you enjoyed that really nice to speak with machete and Luke, we were onto some new territory today. Weren't we, Buddy Works taking a lot of the Dole, complicated, boring, and frankly, difficult things to do, and hopefully making them easier and less time consuming. They can just go on in the background.

Hopefully that was an interesting episode. If anything, sparks your curiosity. Don't forget to reach out to the guys. We're going to put all the links in the show. Just go to WP Builds.com and search for episode number 265. Also while you're there. Why not? Subscribe? WP Builds.com forward slash subscribe.

And don't forget, we will be back on a Monday. We do our live show this week in WordPress, myself, and some notable WordPress guests, every Monday, 2:00 PM, UK time at our live URL, which as you might expect is WP Builds.com forward slash live. We'll be there 2:00 PM every Monday, and then we release that the next day.

But if you don't get any of that, we'll be back on Thursday for another podcast. Okay. All that it remains for me to do is fading. Some cheesy music wish you a very safe and happy week. And I'll say bye-bye for now.

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Nathan Wrigley
Nathan Wrigley

Nathan writes posts and creates audio about WordPress on WP Builds and WP Tavern. He can also be found in the WP Builds Facebook group, and on Mastodon at wpbuilds.social. Feel free to donate to WP Builds to keep the lights on as well!

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