207 – Running a growing WordPress plugin company

Interview with Shahjahan Jewel and Nathan Wrigley

There are some companies in the WordPress space that are very much on the rise and today we’re speaking to Shahjahan Jewel about his company WP Manage Ninja, and they certainly are rising!

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I heard about WP Manage Ninja about a year ago, when they did a lifetime deal sale on their WP Fluent Forms plugin. After some research, I hopped on the deal and I”ve never looked back. It’s become my go-to plugin for forms because of it’s reliability and fast pace of development. The features that they’ve added have been useful and well executed.

Being ‘on the rise’ as I described it often means having one product and focussing on that – getting eyeballs on it. This, however, is not the approach that the team have taken. You see they have been releasing updates to their current suite of plugins, but also working on new products.

Their plugins now include:

It’s a mighty line up!

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In the podcast Shahjahan Jewel and I spoke about how the compamy came to be and what their philosophy is. Why they decided to build out some plugins in areas of the market that already appear to saturated.

We get into the subject of Lifetime Deals and whether or not this was a good marketing mechanism, or something that saddled them with customers who they have for life but who will never pay again.

The structure of the teams get some attention too. We learn that they allocate specific people to work on specific products meaning that they really get to understand the product and all of the features as well as what the customers want to be added.

The speed of this company is really pretty remarkable and that is evidenced by the fact that we recorded this episode just a few months back. Normally this would be fine, but in this case, since the recording the team have launched a new product. We do get into this, but at the time of recording it did not have the name set in stone. It does now… Fluent CRM.

Fluent CRM enables you to segment people inside of WordPress for all sorts of reasons, and send them emails. It could be e-commerce, it could be the way they interact with WordPress, the amount of times they log in. The sky really is the limit. I know a few people who have been using it and have found it to be really effective, especially as it takes all of the interactions inside of your WordPress website as possible triggers for actions.

Finally wespent a little bit of time talking about why they are unique. This comes down to the code quality that Jewel thinks they bring to the table. That, and the fact that they’re bringing a lot of new and innovative products to the market.

Keep your eyes wide open for WP Manage Ninja, I’m sure that we’ll be hearing more about them in the months and years to come.

Mentioned in this podcast:

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Transcript (if available)

These transcripts are created using software, so apologies if there are errors in them.

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Welcome to the WP Builds podcast, bringing you the latest news from the WordPress community. Welcome your host, David Waumsley, Nathan Wrigley.
[00:00:21] Hello there and welcome to the WP Builds podcast. This is episode number 207 entitled running a growing WordPress plugin company. It was published on Thursday, the 26th of November, 2020. Just one thing before we begin, it is black Friday, just around the corner and WP built. I've got all of your WordPress needs, absolutely covered.
[00:00:44] We've got a ton of work. over 150 on a searchable field. Triple page. [email protected] forward slash black that's WP Builds.com forward slash black and white. Pretty much everything that I could find I've put on that one page so that you don't have to go looking trolling through emails and scanning a whole load of independent websites.
[00:01:06] Find them all there and use that page. Yeah. And many of them are affiliate links. So it does help keep the WP Builds.com lights on and would be most appreciative. If you want to bookmark that page and use it in the days to come. If you want to keep in touch with us, head over to WP Builds.com forward slash subscribe.
[00:01:25] That's our YouTube channel Facebook group and email us. You'll find it all there. The WP build's podcast was brought to you today by AB split test. Do you want to set up your AB split tests in record time? Like in a couple of minutes, use your existing pages and test anything against anything else?
[00:01:42] Buttons, images, headers, rows, anything. And the best part is it works with element or Beaver builder and the WordPress block editor. Go check it out and get a [email protected]. Okay. Today's podcast 207 running a growing WordPress plugin company. Today. I'm speaking with Juul from WP managed Ninja. This is a company that's very much on the rise at the moment.
[00:02:07] You've probably heard of some of their products. So for example, they've got WP fluent forms, WP Ninja tables, WP. Pay form. And most recently, a new offering in the WordPress space, fluent CRM. I speak today with Juul, all about why he set up the company, how his company is structured, how they view their products, what importance that they place on one thing over another, how do they decide what gets developed and so on, I'm really beguiled by the stuff that they're putting out.
[00:02:34] I jumped on fluent foams or. I don't know, probably about a year ago now, and I've been incredibly happy with it and it's just really refreshing talking to him about his aspirations for the company and what's coming up next. The company is moving so fast that by the time this episode is airing, which is in November, 2020, what we were recorded at a few months ago.
[00:02:55] And yeah. Fluent CRM hadn't even been released at that point. So there's quite a bit of a clear blue sky between this recording and what you can actually find on their website now. So definitely go and check it out. Have a look at the link in the show notes and see if you would like to get on board with any of their products.
[00:03:12] Lovely podcast, lovely guy. I hope that you enjoy it. Hello there and welcome to the WP Builds podcast. Once more. Thanks for joining us. And thanks for staying to this part today, we have an interview and I've got somebody on the line who I've spoken to once before, but I've messaged a little bit, I think, on Facebook messenger.
[00:03:32] And I've certainly been interacting with some of. The products that him, he and his team have been producing. So may I introduce you to Juul? Say hi, Joel, tell us who you are, where you come from and what company you represents and so on. hello. Juella. mainly, I worked for, WB men in India. I am located physically located in, Bangladesh, and in silod town.
[00:03:58] So fairly small, beautiful town. And we have around, tardy developers, designers, and engineers here that, we are trying to build or plus products mainly. but maybe we will have SaaS products too. So basically, we build, or purchase products that work for, is in business peoples. So our, on up the greatest product is Flint farms, maybe many people, maybe you already in stat also we have negative bills and other correct.
[00:04:32]that's it. And, we started, w management, back totals in swimming can actually. So it's not a long journey, but I started breasts around 10 years ago. So when I was secondary in my graduation, Okay. Yeah. the, that is primarily how I've come across you. I don't really recall how it happened, but there was this great furor, last year where, your company manage, sorry.
[00:05:00]WP managed Ninja puts out a lifetime deal on what has become my go-to forms, plugin. So if you've not heard about it before, I would. Strongly urge you to go and check out fluent forms. It's a, it's a really totally credible alternative to whatever you're using so far. it's got all the bells and whistles as you might expect, but, just to begin the conversation, I'm interested in why you decided to do a lifetime deal.
[00:05:28] What was all that about? was it just to get a bit of notoriety to get your foot in the door to get your name recognized? What was, why did you decide to suddenly throw lifetime? Pricing at us. Basically, phone prompts. It said long ambition project of ours. We started friend prompts, to create civil, I think, yeah, two years ago.
[00:05:49] So developed that, friend palms, the past portion. When you do this, a friend prompts, it was like a one hour one, ER, work like three developers. And we invested lots of money and lots of time resources, everything on it and where to develop that. So basically, before that, Hawaii, we started to learn from sexually though.
[00:06:15] Probably mean his current, problem is with the poor market specifically in, or pres, that has some great products like, gravity forms, conform to then, danger points, I think a couple of forms and many forms. And it's a really a crowded market, but we want it to, in order to go there because we thought that, it can be, to put, should have, really, better alternative.
[00:06:42] Of that, great, no big names because the big names don't actually do lots. I don't, upgrade their product for a long time and don't mess with the car. Like mostly, in the last couple of years, all the SaaS companies or web actually most school, with JavaScript. And they making the user experience better and better.
[00:07:09] So we thought that maybe this is your point where if we start now, Then we can give better option for the users, with, powered by JavaScript. so basically then we started, from problems. We, and, after I completed the project for the, on your long run, Yeah, development feds then, hardware.
[00:07:34] So that , second product before that we just build . So how do we understood that maybe it was a wrong decision to bail Flint pumps in the time because no, where they actually using our product. it's good. We can see it's good. Yeah. But when we show someone, they're saying, okay, you scored, maybe I'll not Sue from the other end of the product that he is using the difference.
[00:08:04] Okay. So it's very hard to convince lots of people to use our product. so then we decided that maybe we, somehow we have to acquire customers so they can use it. They can understand the power of, or lagging and, then, we will get some attention. So then we, so I talked with, many, Users and admins in MarTech group, actually, mainly.
[00:08:32]I met with someone, in art camp, Singapore, and his name, name, Leo. So very good person. Very good guy, great guy, and said then, then Leo told me that your plugin is great and I am sure if you get better, attention of the users, they need to do very, helpful for the marketing to the marketing of the, tool.
[00:08:56]Then we made some, gensets with some added, some more features. we upgraded that UI again, and then we offer the lifetime deal in Midland MarTech, Facebook group, and impacted, our, our regular users to, you know, to cry that at least The past. so we ran that I think three weeks, and to be honest, 30 big response.
[00:09:23] We've got very big response. We made lots of cells to be honest. And then, we did it in physical group, and, inviting our users to join that. Then we understand that, okay, now people are talking to us and they are using it. And we've got many people from gravity forms. So I think most of our paid customers that we have, most of them are from mainly gravity forms.
[00:09:50] And then they are telling that, okay, we could not do that in gravity forms. We had to buy third party, add ons to do this pitcher. And now we are actually can do that, in, from farms and they don't have to, buzzers and install, maintain. And are there not like 10 adults? How do we can do everything in print prompts and.
[00:10:12] That user experience is very good because it's like the stop app. but in the web, odd press and, because it's powered by, most player Java script, we use peels years, for the builder. so then what we did accelerate then Hart, we take a very good decision that we will not decide hard.
[00:10:34] The next feature will be. Our customers will decide that. So we, I believe we, the create a day, Trello board, at least the public Trello board. And we told our users that maybe you can just set a status or do on onto scene the next portion. And, other users will report that and we will work on that top.
[00:10:56] Put it. Features. So then the next eight months, I think so next days, month is just, we worked with our users. We talked with our users, we listen hard, they want to say, so we got some great minds in from our customers and they helped us to tell us that, okay, you should focus on this development, issues, then, then it would be very good for your nurse.
[00:11:21]it was kinda late. It is still, it is like company driven project, actually. So mostly our users actually decide a heart. They want to see the portion. So in the last year, with this in the last, eight months, we develop, we is. I think poor bagel updates, and now users are very happy.
[00:11:44]our, in the last three months, I think our growth is like more than a hundred percent and, w Fern farms is doing really great. So one question actually, so our main target is not about the money that we will get from the LTD buyers, but to engage more users, help us to build based on plugin in odd press.
[00:12:12] And we are actually. doing that, every month. And still, if you go to our. Public, board of trumps in Trello, then you will see that, hardware working in this current quarter Hartwick completed in the last quarter. And what do we did the previous quarter? So everything is actually transparent, clean, open.
[00:12:35] So say if we don't work late, Two months for development. people will get notice that, okay, we're not working on something for that. You can, anytime in the time you can get specific quiz, component, we are working on part. We are actually, religion in the, next, at this quarter or end of this month like that.
[00:12:57]that, that was the, most deficient of us too. get, more feedbacks to work with users to understand their pain point and solve that. So I think if you go to any random Facebook group development or personal group, and, just a post, like a hoard foams, a braggy form plugin, you recommend that.
[00:13:19] I am sure that. you will get at least one, one shown from our customers that they will tell you that it was friend prompts and they were likely busier. Yeah. That's a really nice story. it, there's so many stories which are reasonably similar, but not quite the same in that I've spoken to a lot of people now who've taken different gambles and they've decided to go down a certain route and they hope it work out.
[00:13:42] And it always strikes me that. Listening to your customers is the correct way to win an audience. if you're putting your public roadmap out there and allowing people to contribute on it, and more importantly, if you're starting out with a plugin in this case, fluent forms, and you're quite open to deciding where it's going to go listening to those people and taking those.
[00:14:03] Taking those viewpoints on is only going to grow it. And obviously those people there, they're really invested in it. Now I jumped on that lifetime deal. I thought it was a fabulous offer. And at that point, there couldn't have been any certainty around whether or not things were going to work out, but they did.
[00:14:19] And I'm really pleased about it now. And so you've got me as a customer and it makes you feel that. In the future, that because of the way that you've handled the updates and the honesty that you've provided in the groups that I've been a part of, makes me feel that well, next time they release something new, I'll definitely be taking a closer look.
[00:14:36]yeah, Bravo, but listening to your audience, that was actually quite a brave thing to do because throwing lifetime pricing. it could go the other way, couldn't it? You could end up with a hundred thousand customers, all of whom wants support for exactly, a hundred thousand different reasons.
[00:14:51] And then the ship sinks onto the support burden. Yeah, exactly. So basically, many companies do like extra Modell, or other lifetime deal. I don't like to run two months, add deal sets only because I read many things about SaaS companies, they're going, of getting bankrupt and they're shoved down their service.
[00:15:16] I think the problem was, lifetime deals is actually how a customer calls, costs, are, yeah. Silverpop per month. For the SaaS services, like they have to run their sidebars. They have to give you the resources to, to run that Lander software. in our case, actually, that I, we don't have a mass cost.
[00:15:40] So for you say you are on a poor customer. So for that, we don't have. That ongoing cost for you. We have that develop development cost, and that is coming from our regular sales externally. And we are growing really good, really fast, on cost that is, polio, as a customer that is our support cost.
[00:16:00] And if give us too many support tickets, then, it will cost or a Costco that would cost for our support engineers. That's a good thing actually about that hot that we thought about that. And then we think that, our port is really great. We have documentations. So people like first, see the documentation and if they don't get answered, from the documentation, they submitted support tickets and desktop only cost for customer.
[00:16:32] So basically we took that drugs that we will, we are confident that, Baby. If we make great product, we import blocks of tanks. Then we'll get lists, support tickets. And, that's why we can invest our money to the support team, and then we will grow fast. that the way we took actually, but for assessment, when it does not make sense, for the lifetime deal.
[00:16:57] Yeah, I do. Sometimes I look at these things on AppSumo and so on. I do wonder how does that work over two years? but you're right. You don't have the, you don't have the burden. You basically got to create the code, update the code and ship the code, and then it's on everybody. Else's hardware and infrastructure to make it work.
[00:17:14] So that's a good model. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. if I were, religious has product, I may not, really is, offer a lifetime deal because if I assess actually product always cost me every month for every customer or my server cost and all the other things, infrastructure, those types of things.
[00:17:34] So it doesn't make sense for the SaaS company. To do an LTD unless they had a different motive. Like they want to show them growth right there in the store to get in the spend like that. Otherwise it does not make sense. And, but necessarily growth is always important for, I think, any product and Destiny's own actually, too.
[00:17:58] Go our method out sales, necessarily things. We did the LTD that people there's, people, the initial customers. They will actually talk about us in there to some media of their, to their community. Then we'll get more customers from them. So that was, that's a nice, it's a nice story. You were saying that, That you're currently at about 30, excuse me.
[00:18:22] About 30 people. where were you this time? Let's say a year or maybe two years ago. has it been a company of that size for a long time or have you had to ramp up in the, since the lifetime deal, because things have gotten a lot more busy. not actually big, it's after the life game, Dale did not actually, did mass Jens in our, infrastructure or companies actually, in the last year, I think, one year ago we had 20 people.
[00:18:53] Okay. Now we have 30 people. So like 50% increase of the size of the people actually. yeah, for LTD, we've got many injures, but we see lots of, natural growth, of our product. we hired a new person and another model that we follow in our company that is. His product is like a startup.
[00:19:14]for current forms we have a dedicated team. So they have developers. Currently we have two developers for fin problems and we have dedicated, content writer, marketers, and, at the forefront from Sam goes to Linda tables. When we start in new, product, product, then we actually build a new team.
[00:19:34]so we take some own experience from what existing games and hire new people in that team and start investing in that product and finally lost that. And we continue that, product. And, this is the. Where we do. So basically in the current situation, we started another project actually, and we had to hire new people to support that product, to develop that for act.
[00:19:59] So that's why actually, our, current, new members actually. And, that's and also, we increased, resources influence from Stu because, we are growing fast and we have to add up that. Yeah. That's an interesting strategy, hiving off a different people from within the company to become almost like a separate little company.
[00:20:19] And they are the people that are in charge of that area. So Ninja tables you guys are doing that you guys are doing fluent form so that you know it inside out. Yeah. That's interesting. Having had the experience of taking on a marketplace, which. I felt was already saturated. you've got, you mentioned gravity forms, caldera, you've got contact form seven, you've got WP forms and the list goes on and on formidable.
[00:20:43] And having taken on an incumbent, suite of products and managed to carve a niche out and be successful. Do you see that as something that you will try as a company to do again? And what I mean is. Do you have your eyes set on something which again, people might look at and think there's no way there's any space in the marketplace for that, or are you, is the next product going to be, or the next few products is going to be something completely innovative.
[00:21:10] In other words, are you going to, copy something that's been done, but do it in your words better? Or are you going to try to just do something brand new? Okay. Thank you, sir. It's a mess question, Julian. in OD plus market, the market is totally different than five years ago. as a company, when we look for what the next product will be hot, the next problem we will solve for that users.
[00:21:37]the problem is actually what is a huge area. And I think it will not get any category that, if you search for something in WordPress or Google, like I want to do this, press, you will always get solution, always custom plugin. So the problem is actually that, In some area that had many good solutions in some area, you will not find any good solutions actually.
[00:22:04]for, for friend prompts, it was like, it was, our pedophilia risky decision to go to the poor market actually. But the payoff was huge. Actually, if we. get success. It will be really huge. Okay. So we can just only work on the Flint poems, form plugin and we don't have to work with any other product, that can be a company.
[00:22:28] Yeah. So so eight, it was like a, our, we found that if we can actually do that, if you give the good experience, experience to our users, they will definitely, move that, because no matter how successful a product right now, if they cannot innovate, they cannot, keep up, keep up with that time.
[00:22:50]they will be, they cannot, sustain that. So if you like, remember, high-five okay. So that was a very big company now. no. That company, yeah, this wasn't media. And the same thing, actually, I think, it's not about, how foreign for me actually, how innovative or how, easiest, how unique it is, but it's lot, lots of like how they know how much, how do I can add to the existing the market so people can, flow that, in the future.
[00:23:24] I think that. What I am focusing on, actually, if we, build a new product or in our next product, actually that we are planning to religion or two months from this time, actually that, it will be something really new in, not the whole way we space. Be nice. Yeah. Okay. That's an interesting pivot, the good thing about hitting the form market is that there isn't a WordPress, this is an exaggeration of course, but basically there's no WordPress website without a form on it. Every website has a forum. So you've got to, you've got a fighting chance of the 50 million WordPress websites.
[00:24:05] I don't know what the number is, but it's, I'm sure it's bigger than that. every single one of those needs some kind of form, even if that form is infrequently used, it'll still be on there. So you need some kind of plugin for that. Whereas if you go for something a little bit more unique and a bit more interesting, and you're carving out a completely new market, there's a bit of a gamble there.
[00:24:24] Isn't there and you have to presumably way up. Whether the successful part of the company, the fluent form bit can hold up the research and development into the other new areas and whether or not it can support it if it's not immediately popular and so on. Exactly. So our next product is it's not for everyone.
[00:24:45] It's for mainly the. Maybe agencies or business people, or like e-commerce those types of things. So I can, I think I can actually disclose here the problem here, people will ultimately know that. So our next product is a hard way. Understood that. So we've done it. E-commerce site implemented. And so we run our own shop.
[00:25:06] The problem. We faced in the last couple of, ER, sexual at that, to communicate with our customers, to send emails, to analyze the, analyze that data of, for customers that like how many products do board, which is working too bad. How many support tickets you have submitted? how does the email communication be doing this type of things is very important, for us.
[00:25:30] So when we look up, look at our customer, So then there is half many things. So there has actually many solutions, MailChimp, campaign monitor or drip campaign, those stable access services. The problem is actually the SaaS services. Those are really good. Do their job. The problem for us, it was that.
[00:25:52] We have to feed that data to that platform. And then we have to log in there and see the information of whore one Oh four lead or customer. And we did not find anything in all press area. So there has some plugins like maple head, they can send a nice emails to our, segmented customers, people.
[00:26:16]the problem is actually, it's just, it can only do send emails. That's it? Nothing else. I cannot analyze the data. I cannot sit back and, segment that. So this is my se very high customer, and this is my low paying customer, or this is, this can be a customer like that. We don't have any automation.
[00:26:37] So then we began to lecture, I think last year, Yeah, that can do the job. So I can go to that plugin, a plugin minnow, and it all starts for any email and see the full history of that, customer. So how many product they bought? How many support tickets, this type of, then it was useful for us. Then this year we.
[00:27:01] W we will start seeing that hot new product. We can, bill. So we wanted to build a new product. Then, then after certain category, then we thought that maybe this can be a product that the internal tool we are using, not a company. This can actually help as it's helping us. It can definitely help other people.
[00:27:21] Then that's the idea totally behind our new product. So the product name maybe will be like fluent CRM, for now it's, this name we are using fluent CRM internally. Okay. Yeah. So that's our new product. So it's a, I will say that new idea in WordPress ecosystem, actually that you can actually automate your marketing campaigns, email campaigns, Or, finding the lids, subscriber form, those types of things.
[00:27:50]you can do it like currently. I think we can do, like if someone, But as Ninja bills, we'll send, an email instantly that thank you for, accessing injectables. There's a documentation. You can write us at us anytime. And our support team will help. And after say four days, we can send an email.
[00:28:12] If you have any problem with configuring the injectables or like that, and say another onwards. We can promote our Flint prompts that you can try out for, from store. So you can do that. you can do that in the current version of our plan CRM and you cannot do with any other plug in Nope, or in odd pres natively, no surfer without Eugene air.
[00:28:36]like without using a SaaS service and the SaaS servicers straight, very costly. if I want to send like 50,000 emails or 10,000 to two emails using MailChimp, it will cost me like, 200 or 300 bucks. that's really costly for the small business or midsize businesses.
[00:28:52] But if I can do with odd press, that is my server. then it will, you can use say, I say, I will, Amazon ECS, then it will only cost me like, five bucks or 10 bucks like that. Yeah. Yeah. That's interesting. yeah. Interesting idea. So is this built on top of, I'm going to guess, WooCommerce or is it, your own e-commerce solution?
[00:29:18] Oh, okay. So basically the e-commerce solution is a totally different model, but it's backed with the software. So if you don't have any say you don't sell anything, but you still want to send emails to your subscribers about the podcast. So you can do that. Okay. You can segment like how many clicks people did or that actually you can, If you use your commerce to commerce, then we have that integration. If you use it as a download, we already have the integration because we'll use it citizen download. and we have plans to integrate, more ecosystems, like maybe the LMS market. People many people use now elements, suppliers.
[00:29:59] So we can actually also integrate that. So you can send campaign emails to specific students. Like I want to send the emails to the there's only this course, the students like that. Got it. Yeah. Yeah. So it would be, I think interesting actually, it would be really helpful, I think for, save lots of, problem, lots of time save lots of time, of our customers to small businesses.
[00:30:27] So the nice thing about the WordPress ecosphere and the people within it is that they're not afraid to try out new things. Other, if they come across something like this, they could, they can give it a go for a, usually a fairly low entry price of a subscription for one site for one year.
[00:30:47] That seems to be the usual model. If you're going to just try something out and, And, they're not absolutely beholden. So as an example, I, for a little while I've used MailChimp and then I found something that suited me better and MailChimp went out the window and I tried something new and because we're a fairly technical bunch and we're not afraid to get our hands dirty and we're not afraid of the technology.
[00:31:07] And it doesn't really bother us that we've got to get used to a new UI. Sorry, a new UI. we give those things a go and I've seen nothing quite like what you've described before. So that does seem really interesting. Yeah. You're going to have to get, have to praise people away from, like you say, MailChimp and, active campaign and all those kinds of things, but yeah, from what you've described, if it can hook into all the WordPress things and filter and, create little segmented lists based upon interactions within WordPress, that's going to be really interesting.
[00:31:38] Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So that's why we build it. So I think the problem with the SaaS services actually, they cannot actually access your WordPress. They actually will feed the data. Then you will work on that data, but if we can access the opera star that we set into right into WordPress, and we can access all the, or I analyze those things and give you the power to segment your customers and interact with them, then that sounds is actually very high that you can your competition, and it will be definitely high.
[00:32:12] And you give the us more indirect. Do you have, experience of your customers? Yeah. I can see a, I can see a webinar coming on a Juul. I can see a couple of months from now. We're going to have to sit in front of a sit in front and do this in front of a screen so that we can actually show people what it's like.
[00:32:29]we're recording this obviously a little bit before it goes out. That's just the way the podcast is done. But, hopefully later in the year, 2020, we'll be seeing that coming onto the scene. And at the moment you're muting to call it. what did you say? Fluent serum, did you say? Yeah, exactly. Nice. So I think.
[00:32:49] Ask them publicly. I am, telling this. Yeah. W Y you've got to safe. Like I said before, we started, there's a safety net here, because the podcast is recorded a fairly significant amount of time before it's going out. And, let's hope too many secrets aren't revealed. I would love to have you back though, to chat through whatever it ends up being and whatever it's called.
[00:33:09] And however it looks that would be fabulous. You found that even people easily and know this right now, it's not a problem because if someone actually wants to clone it or make a different portion of it from getting the ideal, this theirs. Not actually, that's not going to take a fortnight. Yeah.
[00:33:30] Two weeks is not enough to, to replicate the functionality that you've just described. That really does interest me. I've tried all sorts of WordPress solutions for doing email, some of them successful, but only as a method of spraying email out, not so much of filtering and deciding that this part.
[00:33:47] Over here. This segment over here should do this and this segment over here should do that. So that's really interesting. Yeah. I think that'll be something to watch. we've probably running out of time to be honest, but I don't want you to go, without having an opportunity to, mention anything else that you feel that you didn't get a chance to mention.
[00:34:03] So yeah. usually it's a chance to talk about where you are on Twitter or a product or a deal that you've got going on. But as we're recording a little bit in advance, that's probably not going to happen, but just tell us where we can find you, how we can reach out to you and anything you like. Okay. I am actually I work with our, the whole team in, in our company, actually.
[00:34:24] So if you send any email in order to set up dot com contact form, I manage that email because they want to, know more about, customers. So we'll get that too. I'll get back to you and other, a nice place will be the Flint forms group. Mainly I am very active. In that group. I tried to, try to engage with every customers that they post or comments.
[00:34:50] So that will be, I think, the best place not to interact with me in a Facebook group. If you want to talk about anything also, I talk with many people in Facebook, Facebook, if someone actually sent messages, I definitely answered that in same day. so Facebook, splitting as I use for my business, it's only, and also I am in Twitter.
[00:35:14] My handle is tech Jewell, but, I'm not very active in Twitter, but differently in Facebook. And, I'll say that the products we built in manners Ninja, we don't build, like random products. Or, lots of product. We went about building new product. it's two months or three months, thinking, analyzing those teams.
[00:35:40] And every product is the code quality is very high, because. I'm fortunate that when I started, the implementers Ninja, then I could hire a CTO, very experienced CTO. He is like my, 10 years old, in, like with the experience. he is in stack overflow, kids, less into 1%, so yeah. Ranking the whole org ranking, I think under six, 600. So where billions of developers are, they are, and in that ranking is like 600. So here's his beautifully experience. Like he has 20 years experience. Basically, he actually manage our, the CTO, he manager other developers and he makes sure that the code we are writing, those are really, excludable or maintainable.
[00:36:28]because we have, plan to bend in those products for years, not just, make a product, sell that, not like that. so I'll definitely tell you that, if you really on very high call it products in the, based on the code, then you should, you can try our product or all of our products are actually free.
[00:36:51] And we have, pro shown as an add-on, but all our production, she, you can download that, try that, and, it will be good. And if you find any bugs or anything, we can always, send us support tickets and those are totally free. We also, give support to all our free users and, on thing that is different than big companies or other companies, that is our support.
[00:37:15] We always. I give a top support or users, always tried to do that. and most of all are, I think 99% of our customers are very happy. That the support we did. We do. so that's the one thing that I can proud of that the support and good quality there is like unparalleled. just speaking.
[00:37:38] Yeah. Speaking from the perspective of somebody that took a pump on it and gave it a go. the fluent forms is. Like I said, become the way that I do it now. And I can attest to the fact that it's received significant updates, not just to the sort of features that have been added on over the last year or so, but also with things like the UI took a, a big change of direction in the last few weeks.
[00:38:01]they've got a, they've got a capability influent forms to actually customize the way it looks, the form, the way it looks within the UI. So you can, I don't know, change the width of the button and make the button blue and make the form borders go red or whatever you like. It's all done in a point click interface.
[00:38:16] It's really good. So I can attest to that great product. And other thing, actually. maybe people, many people actually say that, maybe a fluid problem sets early, to be honest, in the past it was like, it's like a copycat, a front runner is a copycat of gravity forms or, pallet of columns or those things.
[00:38:33] But, over the last one year, she starts, we have added in Clint prompts. Don't other poems have. Okay, no other, I, I can say no other farms have, like we have, or only styler, no other prompts. It gives you the style of Sean's to style your poems. yeah. In, in that same component, like we have, we have other many other fields, unique fields that we have that no other people that aren't on feature that we have.
[00:39:02]we, released last, I think, last week. That is, you can actually, like if you have a normal contract from, you will get lots of, manually spot spams, by this SEO course by this SEO search is, or automated bot, those type of things. what do I did actually the last, The last week that we, at least one feature you can actually ban any palms submission based on the user data.
[00:39:28]if the, text area, includes any link, that can, that's maybe a board or some SEO guy, they want to sell something. So you can ban that and you will not get that feature to any other. Okay. Palm again. And so like that we have a lot, so new features that we have introduced, our inner bragging, like we have a feature from the last year.
[00:39:57] I think that is you can analyze the data with jarred and, like charts and graphs. And see, what does the, what does the, say you have a checkbox and you can analyze, what does the most, check item on, what does the number of, selection from say a hundred, 100, 100, submission.
[00:40:18] So you can do that. And this type of features actually don't offered by any other, sector. So yeah, we have edit actually lots of innovation. yeah, I can probably attest to this. Yeah. I'm very pleased that I've invested in this. There's lots of things that have happened and lots of things on the roadmap, but we'll, we'll definitely keep an eye out.
[00:40:38] We're BDRs on the, on the new, fluent serum and see how that goes. Joel, thank you so much for joining us today. Sadly. We're out of time. Hopefully we'll see you on the WP build's news again. That was nice to have you on and, yeah, thanks for coming on the podcast today. Really appreciate it. Yeah.
[00:40:55] Thank you. I hope that you enjoyed that. Always very nice chatting to somebody about something new in this case. WP managed Ninja, really interesting to see how they've managed to scale their business and how they've decided to allocate the roles within that business. And what's coming and what's coming next.
[00:41:10] Looks like a safe bet. I would say at this point in time, investing in WP managed Ninja. So go and check it out. Click on the links in the show notes to find those individual products, WP fluent forms, WP Ninja tables, WP pay form, and fluent CRM. Don't forget to check out the WP Builds.com black Friday deals page that is WP Builds.com forward slash black a searchable filterable list.
[00:41:38] I've made the effort so that you don't have to go trolling around all over the place. So that URL, once more WP Builds.com forward slash black. The WP build's podcast was brought to you today by AB split test. Do you want to set up your AB split tests in record time? The new AB split test plugin for WordPress.
[00:41:57] We'll have you up and running in a couple of minutes. Use your existing pages and test anything against anything else. Buttons, images, headers, rows, anything. And the best part is it works with element or Beaver builder and the WordPress block editor. You can check it out and get a [email protected].
[00:42:13] Okay, we will be back next Thursday for another podcast. This time it will be me and David Wamsley going through the, a to Zed of WordPress. Also on Monday, I'll be releasing the newsletter. You can find [email protected]. And on a Tuesday, we will be releasing the live version of the news. Now, slightly strangely, we record that live on Monday at 2:00 PM.
[00:42:37] UK [email protected] forward slash live. And then I'm going to be editing it as a sort of podcast episode and releasing that on a Tuesday. So lots in store stay tuned. I hope that you have a nice week. Stay safe. Cheesy music fading in. Bye bye. For now. .

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Nathan Wrigley
Nathan Wrigley

Nathan writes posts and creates audio about WordPress on WP Builds and WP Tavern. He can also be found in the WP Builds Facebook group, and on Mastodon at wpbuilds.social. Feel free to donate to WP Builds to keep the lights on as well!

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