This Week in WordPress #374

[00:00:03] Nathan Wrigley: It's time for This Week in WordPress, episode number 374 entitled, It's all about the Weather. It was recorded on Monday, the 25th of May, 2026. My name's Nathan Wrigley, and today I am joined by Michelle Frechette, by Courtney Robertson and Mike Johnston.

We talk about WordPress. We spend most of the time, talking about the recent WordPress 7.0 release. What's in it? What do we like, what got missed out?

And then we have a little bit of time talking about some new things in the WordPress space. There's a browser extension which has come out. There's a lot of AI news. And then towards the end, we spend a bit of time talking about events, and the whole thing is enormously peppered with comments about the weather.

It's all coming up next on This Week in WordPress.

It's a bank holiday here in the uk, which means that everybody is off work except

[00:01:05] Michelle Frechette: us.

Still Are we?

[00:01:06] Nathan Wrigley: Oh, you've got the same

[00:01:07] Michelle Frechette: Yes, it's our Memorial Day.

[00:01:10] Nathan Wrigley: Oh. okay. So a bank holiday in the uk. I have no idea why they exist, but they're called that we get four a year or something like that. Memorial Day sounds like it's got a a, meaning though that sounds like Oh, it does. Oh, go on. Tell me about Memorial Day.

I genuinely know nothing.

[00:01:28] Michelle Frechette: It's to commemorate those who have, whose lives were lost in battle, for the United States.

[00:01:34] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. Okay. So it spans all the. Conflicts.

[00:01:38] Michelle Frechette: All of the conflicts It does, and it's usually there's a parade in Tan in my small town today. It's a parade in the local big city today. and there will be, it's also unofficially the kickoff to summer.

So we will have a lot of picnics and barbecues today, which will not be to celebrate anybody, but rather just to kick off the summer. So we start, our mornings very reverent, and we finish our day elbows deep in barbecue sauce,

[00:02:06] Mike Johnston: curing hot dogs,

[00:02:08] Courtney Robertson: except that for a large part of the country it got washed out.

Like they, the outside activities are rained out for much of the country.

[00:02:17] Nathan Wrigley: Okay.

[00:02:17] Michelle Frechette: Yeah. it's

[00:02:18] Nathan Wrigley: rain here

[00:02:18] Michelle Frechette: in

[00:02:19] Nathan Wrigley: here in the UK we have this bank holiday. And unusually for us it's extremely hot here. It's like unnecessarily hot, in fact. And I've got a fan on, which I never normally have. And if the fan is making a lot of noise, or you can detect that my voice, I don't know.

The, software can't pick it up or something. Just yell and I'll switch it off. But if it's possible to keep it on, great. Yeah, that's good. okay. In which case we'll make a proper start. So usually the music would end and I'd say hello. Good. Good afternoon, good morning. Good.

Wherever you are in the world. It's episode number 374 of this week in WordPress. The idea of the show really is to toss around the, news from the last seven days in the WordPress space. with regret, I, suddenly pulled last week's show, so a few of the articles may be creep into sort of 10 day territory, but there's nothing, particularly old.

But, in order to make that happen, I'm always joined by, a panellist, a panel of guests, and, today we've got who you can see on the screen. And if you can't see the screen, then I will just go round the houses and, get everybody to introduce themselves. So we'll start off with Michelle Ette down.

Hello co-host for today's episode. Hello, Michelle. How are you doing?

[00:03:29] Michelle Frechette: Hello. I'm good, thank you. How are you?

[00:03:32] Nathan Wrigley: yeah, good. Really good. And, let's do the bio. Shall we, let's go through and one at a time. Sure. So Michelle's goes as follows. Michelle Fette is the executive Director of Post Status and in addition to her work at Post Status, Michelle is the podcast barista at WP Coffee Talk.

Co-founder of Underrepresented in Tech, creator of WP Speakers, WP Career Pages, and also the co-founder of Sponsor Me WP, as well as Speed Network Online. She is an author. Answer and a frequent organiser and speaker at WordPress and tech events. She lives outside of Rochester, New York, where she's an avid nature photographer.

And the one URL, which sums it all up is Meet michelle.online. Thank you for joining us once more. That is you.

[00:04:17] Michelle Frechette: My pleasure.

[00:04:18] Nathan Wrigley: And, maybe to be invaded by somebody today. I don't know. We had somebody wandering around in the background. Let's see. It's normally the cat.

[00:04:25] Michelle Frechette: I think he left so he wouldn't be wandering around

[00:04:28] Nathan Wrigley: during the show.

Oh, okay. Okay. nevermind. But, anyway, thank you so much for joining us. Appreciate it.

[00:04:33] Michelle Frechette: My

[00:04:34] Nathan Wrigley: pleasure. joining us again, I think maybe the second time, perhaps the third time I can't actually remember is Mike Johnson. How are you doing, Mike?

[00:04:41] Mike Johnston: I'm wonderful today, Nathan. Thank you.

[00:04:44] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, you're very welcome.

Are

[00:04:45] Mike Johnston: you?

[00:04:46] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, Good, good. I've actually forgotten where in the United States you are. Where are you based?

[00:04:51] Mike Johnston: Lewiston, Idaho, which is the far western edge of Idaho. We're just across the Snake River from Washington State.

[00:04:59] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. Alright. what

[00:05:01] Michelle Frechette: time is it there? Your accent? Is your accent Idahoan? Because it doesn't

[00:05:04] Mike Johnston: sound idahoan.

No, my accent. My accent is Southern. Particularly when I'm tired and it's 6:00 AM here, oh,

it's gonna get thicker as the hour goes on until

[00:05:16] Nathan Wrigley: the,

[00:05:17] Mike Johnston: until the coffee kicks in. 6:00 AM That's brutal. so Michelle, I have a question about that thing just before we do Mike's bio. Yeah. This is gonna sound really ignorant and it probably is really ignorant.

[00:05:29] Nathan Wrigley: Can you spot like really hyper specific regional accents in the US? Because forgive me, I basically can spot like the Southern accent. I can pick up on that kind of drawl and I can pick up New York, that kind of Neighbourhood. But basically anything else to me melds into one thing. So for me, there's three, there's like the generic us, there's the south, and then there's that kind of like New York East Coast thing.

Is there, is it like significantly more granular than that?

[00:06:02] Michelle Frechette: Yes.

[00:06:02] Nathan Wrigley: Oh, okay.

[00:06:03] Michelle Frechette: It can be, but it depends on where you live as to whether you can spot the differences. 'cause it's such a big place. So I can detect a southern accent, but I can't necessarily tell you what state it's from.

[00:06:16] Nathan Wrigley: Okay.

[00:06:16] Michelle Frechette: Usually I can pick out Texas 'cause it's Okay.

Relatively different from like Alabama and Georgia and Okay. the Carolinas and such, the Tennessee, and then Florida because it's so far south. and it's really filled with Northerners through the wintertime. It just sounds like us.

[00:06:34] Nathan Wrigley: Oh, okay. Okay.

[00:06:35] Michelle Frechette: or Hispanic. There's a huge Hispanic population in Florida.

[00:06:38] Nathan Wrigley: Oh, okay. Okay. And that adds another thing into the melting pot.

[00:06:42] Michelle Frechette: Yeah. But I'm in, New York, but I don't have a New York accent because you're talking New York City, long Island. Where they say things like coffee, I'm gonna get my coffee. Okay. yes, it'll be really interesting because obviously in the UK that whole evolution of language thing has had a, like quite a long time to, to happen.

[00:07:01] Nathan Wrigley: and the The geographical differences can be a, just a matter of. 15 miles and it changes. really a lot angle,

[00:07:10] Michelle Frechette: especially.

[00:07:11] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Yeah. And I just wonder if, given another 500 or a thousand years of American history, it'll be really interesting. will you even be intelligible to each other?

the Californians like, need some translation for the New Yorkers anyway,

[00:07:24] Michelle Frechette: I, I don't, spot a difference between me and Courtney's accent, but she might hear a Rochester Broad a and mine. Okay. 'cause I don't hear it, but other people hear a Rochester accent when I say things like Rochester.

[00:07:35] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. Anyway, I got completely derailed. I'm about

[00:07:37] Courtney Robertson: six hours do South of Michelle, by the way. Oh,

[00:07:40] Nathan Wrigley: but that's, nothing in the US is it? that's one. No,

[00:07:45] Courtney Robertson: that's an usually afternoon drive.

[00:07:47] Nathan Wrigley: That's, yeah. I'm gonna come

[00:07:48] Michelle Frechette: joinin her for lunch later. No,

[00:07:51] Courtney Robertson: that would be impressive. She might,

[00:07:54] Nathan Wrigley: I, I always get, I love the, topic of, like dialect and language and all of that.

So I often get derailed on that, but Mike, sorry, you got know it was

[00:08:04] Michelle Frechette: me because I just had to know where he was from, yeah, yeah. here we go. So here's Mike's bio. Mike Johnson is an experienced technical manager, coach, and business leader, having spent over 40 years managing people, projects, budgets, and businesses.

[00:08:18] Nathan Wrigley: His WordPress journey began in 2018 when he started the Cook and the writer.com, a food and travel blog. He co-authors with his wife Mary. He owns a small consulting firm, which is called Third Act Partners, where he builds websites and does business development for small business clients and nonprofit organisations.

Whilst living in Portugal for three and a half years. Mike spent, Mike was an organiser at Word Camp Europe, which, happened in Porto, Athens and Torino during his stewardship and partnered in meetup groups in Porto and Lisbon. He's looking forward to reconciling with his colleagues and friends during Word Camp Europe, which is happening, gosh, like, next week, basically.

[00:08:59] Mike Johnston: Next week.

[00:09:00] Nathan Wrigley: He cu Oh, if I'd read your bio correct me and not given up on it, I would've found that Mike currently lives in Lewiston, Idaho. We knew that, with his wife, Mary and Lily, a rambunctious Boston Terrier puppy. Oh, no. Sounds fun. Mike and Mary have just begun a year long celebration of their 50th wedding anniversary.

oh, congrat. Congratulations. Congratulations. That's so milestone. Blindy. Well done. That's incredible.

[00:09:32] Mike Johnston: it, speaks to the tolerance and patience of my wife that she stood up with me for all these

[00:09:37] Nathan Wrigley: years. Well done, sir. played. that's lovely. but there's Mike, Johnson joining us and hopefully we'll get to see you next week, Mike, if, if I'm sure our paths will cross at some point, I

[00:09:50] Mike Johnston: think they'll,

[00:09:51] Nathan Wrigley: and third, but by no means least is Courtney Robertson.

How are you doing, Courtney?

[00:09:56] Courtney Robertson: Hello? I am doing well. Developer advocate still these days at GoDaddy.

[00:10:02] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah.

[00:10:03] Courtney Robertson: and just having a good time playing around with what's come WordPress seven recently.

[00:10:07] Nathan Wrigley: Nice. you've actually already done the bio because the bio was like a collection of words. It was four words, con Robertson developer advocate at GoDaddy.

So we've done it twice. thank you.

[00:10:21] Michelle Frechette: I wanna thank Courtney for stepping in. She just, within the last week she agreed to be on the show today.

[00:10:26] Nathan Wrigley: I thank you, Michelle, for remembering that. That's lovely.

[00:10:29] Michelle Frechette: And I took over from Mark who just landed in, I think Scotland or something. It

[00:10:33] Nathan Wrigley: always change around, wasn't it?

Yeah. Yeah, he's

[00:10:35] Michelle Frechette: in the

[00:10:35] Nathan Wrigley: uk. Oh, anyway, let's not get into

[00:10:37] Michelle Frechette: that. Yeah, he was playing last night, so I just don't know where was landing.

[00:10:40] Nathan Wrigley: okay. let's get into the WordPress stuff. There is a lot to say. Just a couple of bits of housekeeping before we begin though, if you fancy, joining us. depending on where you are, we're doing this live, depending on what platform you're on.

Quite a lot of the platforms simply don't allow the synchronisation of comments. they're just stuck in that little silo and I can't have five or six screens open. It's just too much for my adult brain. and so the best thing to do is to just drive everybody here, which is wp builds.com, forward live.

And if you go there, you will see an embed of this video, but on the right you'll see Google's YouTube comments. So why I say Google is you need a Google account if you wanna make those comments. But if you, don't wish to do that, you can just click the little button inside the video itself. There's a little bottom top right.

And click that and you can make some comments. And we love it when people make the comments. and send people to that as well. I realise that we're up against the, the vagaries of bank holiday in the UK and Memorial Day in the us so I'm not expecting quite as many comments today, but you never know.

We might get lucky,

[00:11:47] Michelle Frechette: but we already have a couple, do we now? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I have it set up in such a way that I have the, I have the first things to do first and Oh, yeah. There we go. Lovely. Then I got Marcus Burnett, another Floridian, joining us. There he goes, happy Monday. He says, you're all looking great.

[00:12:04] Nathan Wrigley: That's a nice, I comment, we never get comments about how we look and, yeah. I'm feeling pretty good about it now. Thanks. Yeah. Not bad, huh? Which bits about each of us look good, Marcus? Thank you. We'd like a list in the comments, please. Yeah, I'm feeling make it awkward. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, you'll get a nice comment in a moment.

and Lana Miro joining us as well. Hello, Lana.

[00:12:28] Michelle Frechette: Hey Lana.

[00:12:29] Nathan Wrigley: saying good day, everyone. Feel free to add those comments in. If you do, I'll try and put 'em on the screen. Obviously, if you don't, I shouldn't be able to. Let's get into the bits and pieces that were on the discussion today. Let me actually find the right tab, and here it is, right.

Okay. Got 'em all secreted over there. So just a couple of bits of housekeeping. this is us wp builders.com. If you put your name into this ear box, then, email address, we'll send you a couple of emails each week. One when we send this episode out, that'll come tomorrow. And also, when we put an episode of the podcast out, which we do on a Thursday, and I just thought I'd mention last Thursday's episode, it was with RT Camp's, love Cash Kumar, talking about a new product that he's got in the offering.

And, basically it's called WPM, which is a package manager for WordPress. Honestly, it's a little bit above my pay grade. I'm clinging on for dear life. Bless love cash. She had to, had to keep schooling me as we went through it, but if that sounds like your bag, then go and check that episode out.

Cameron's joined us as well. Good afternoon from a very humid Brighton. Yeah, right? Isn't it? You are from Australia. You know what heat is like? It's actually almost Australian, in terms of heat here at the minute. It's a bit insane, right? Let's get into the actual news then. Many of these articles of, towards the beginning of the show have come, courtesy of Mike.

He was very kind to fill in a bunch of stuff in the show notes, but, I think many of them would've arrived in the show anyway. But here we go. Big milestone in the WordPress space, WordPress 7.0, which is, called Armstrong. I didn't realise we'd moved into astronauts, but nevermind. I thought we were still, not Neil.

So Louis Armstrong. Yeah, very good. Dad joke. I need a jingle for when I do a dad joke. Armstrong, I'm guessing is after Louis Armstrong, but, here we go. So a big change. Hopefully you've managed to get all your sites updated. in most cases, I imagine you had to do a bit of that work yourself.

Perhaps you, you had to go in and do that work, or maybe you've got them automatically updated. But we've been talking about WordPress seven for the longest period of time, largely because there was lots of changes coming along, including collaborative editing and things like that. And basically that got dropped and so it got delayed.

It was supposed to be about five weeks ago now that it dropped, but it never did. I'd like to just, I always forget this bit, so I thought I'd do it at the beginning. more than 900 contributors from all over the world, including 279 first timers, 419 core track tickets. were in this release including 76 enhancements, 300 bug fixes, plus 411 Gutenberg enhancements and 486 bog fixes across the editor dashboard and AI integrations.

I'm reading a repository article, and Mike, I dunno if you want to disclose what you disclosed in the show notes, but you, but now he has to.

Yeah. You sitting? Yeah, that's true. You do now. Yeah. Sorry.

[00:15:46] Mike Johnston: No, I'm happy to. I spend, several hours very early on Friday mornings, proofread, proofreading the repository articles for Ray Morey, and it's always, this week particularly was just stunning because the, level of detail and the comprehensive nature of her approach to these things, I just walk away some days amazed.

It's kinda like, how do you keep all that stuff in your head?

[00:16:17] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah.

[00:16:18] Mike Johnston: She's, without

[00:16:19] Nathan Wrigley: p isn't she? I think in the word.

[00:16:22] Mike Johnston: I think. I think so. She's a lovely person to work with.

[00:16:24] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, she's a lovely

[00:16:25] Michelle Frechette: person in general.

[00:16:27] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. I'm pleased, pleased that you are doing it as well, because it's nice to know that she's going that extra mile as well and having somebody cast their eye over it for, but she's a trained journalist.

She does this, properly, everything is cited and there's links buried everywhere. and yeah, so hat tip to Ray, but also to you for, assisting with that project. So this is basically around, all about WordPress seven, which hopefully, as I said, you've now got the biggest, I suppose news because the collaborative editing didn't come, is this WP AI client.

I'll just read, raise words. the biggest edition is the WP AI client, a provider agnostic, API that lets plugin call plugins called generative AI models through a consistent interface without bundling their own SDKs or building custom setting pages. the Abilities API, which shipped a few versions ago, was more of a sort of shared way of doing this.

This is much more of a sort of standardised way of doing it at the moment. My understanding is you've got three options in there. I do not play with AI enough to get my hands dirty in this, but at the moment it go on, Courtney,

[00:17:40] Courtney Robertson: it shipped with four actually. Oh, the fourth one? Yeah, the fourth one being Akismet.

so the interesting anti-spam commenting tool that has been available in core releases for some decades now, I think, is a fourth one that's there.

[00:17:59] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. That's interesting. And also curious because that, that in my head, that doesn't satisfy the, the sort of criteria here, which is, anthropic ask it anything and it'll give you something back Google, Geminis the same, go open ai, the same kind of thing.

I always imagine sort of a kismet being much more binary, do thou shal not pass kind of thing. Does this comment meet a certain spam criteria? that's interesting. Thank you. So is that in the screen there, we're looking at a screenshot of those three connectors.

[00:18:33] Courtney Robertson: Do you know if that's, yeah, so if you were to look at the screenshot on a default WordPress instal now, right?

It would also show akismet there and then of course additional ones would be added if you add more plugins. And so I guess in bringing up Akismet, I, I would encourage folks to think that it's not just connect to a large language learning model for AI purposes, but the ai, I believe in akismet. a ki I haven't tested out the connector particularly with the Kismet, but a Kismet is historically known as blocking spam comments.

And I do know that there is a toggle in these settings that you can get into. There's an optional if you would like to be a bit of a beta tester, right? you can enable one setting in the AI connectors area that shows you, every call, every plugin that wants to be made, et cetera. And one of the features within that is also the ability to moderate comments.

And so I think with the kismet on that comment moderation, that is a tool. Although I've seen a few new people offering services that are similar to a kismet,

[00:19:39] Nathan Wrigley: you know what I, in the, era of ai, like a kismet is in a full on arms race because Yeah. over on the, tavern website, which has a lot of comments, and most of it, let's say 99.99% of it is just spam.

the depth of the spam now is so difficult to determine whether it's spam or not, because it will, it, it will give a perfect rendition. let's say for example, I don't know, there was a, post all about, oh, I dunno, this WordPress 7.0, that spam comment would perfectly reference the article. a lovely summation of why that was a good article, why the person posting the comment would've found it intriguing and then just buried somewhere is a little link or something, but the whole thing looks totally plausible.

And so AI fighting, what have we come to? but yeah. Okay. Thank you.

[00:20:40] Courtney Robertson: Robot worse.

[00:20:42] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Yeah. No kidding. Yeah. I'll just quickly rip through this. There's a slightly different modernised dashboard you may have picked up on it. Basically, I would summarise it as a slightly more jazzy blue that seems, and I don't know, less rounded corners, something like that.

But broadly speaking, it feels and looks very similar. It's not some sort of jarring change if you've got the defaults. the command palette, has now got a dedicated sort of keystroke so that you can invoke that from basically anywhere. You've got font management, it's got its own, page, which surfaces typography and such.

And this, I think for actual people doing writing inside a WordPress like Ray presumably does, I think this is really cool. This is, the revision section has been completely overhauled to bring it in line with, other tools that you may have used out there on the web. So rather than having a diff view of here's what it was and here's what it is now, and it's very hard to tell what the differences are at, were now text is scored out and the new bits have been inserted.

And if you're looking at the screen, you'll be able to detect what that's and that, that's just like a, million times better. than we had in the past. yeah. there are some new design blocks as well. We've got a gallery block, which oh, thank the Lord. now has a default kind of light box slide show in it, rather than just zoom in, zoom out, zoom in, zoom out, which you used to have.

you can see over here there's a bunch of, other, blocks, which are available as well. I won't go into all of those. Responsiveness controls have been o overhauled and menu overlays are now available to you. So you can do something, let's say on mobile. You want something to swing in from the left or something like that, or at least look like it swung in from the left, those kind of things.

And then there's a bunch of developer things as well. So with all that said, I'll just go round the houses. If anybody wants to contribute with their fav bits of WordPress, seven or not, go for it now.

[00:22:52] Courtney Robertson: I'll just kindly toss out that I, I too wrote an article on this one. And, Ray, as always, amazing work.

But yeah, the, some of the feature bits that I really that's in there. now that I've had a chance to go in and use it a bit, one of the things we saw that real time collaboration did not ship yet. but what we did get is oddly in that notes area, actually, Nathan showing it. I personally did a lot to, to instigate and drive this.

I wanna be able to test the beta and RC releases, and I'm going to encourage people test. I pushed a bit at work to see that our customers that are running managed hosting for WordPress would be able on their staging sites to already test the beta and RC releases, before they go live.

So on your staging environment. So we really want people to be testing Oh, test early. Yeah. Nice. So that if you wanna test before the release comes out, right after most beta and RC ship, we made them available in the staging environment. But additionally with that, I just started experimenting, with the connectors on my personal site and I'm testing.

There is a feature when you enable the connectors, that's not real time collaboration, but it does leverage the notes feature that we saw come out in six nine. And it will give you a summary of the work you have done on a particular post. So if you want to leave off, I'm chatting with AI to fix a thing, I gotta step away, go leave me some notes for when I get back about what we've done so far to restart this.

I thought that was a little bit of a hidden gem buried in there.

[00:24:36] Nathan Wrigley: So that's to say that, let's say I've got a half finished article and I've, connected, I don't know, let's go with Anthropic through the connectors, that we saw earlier. Yeah. You can now communicate via the notes feature, which felt like it was a human to human thing, but can equally be a human to AI thing.

Yeah, you can, do that collaboration in there and in your, situation. I don't know, summarise what I've written so that when I come back I know where to start off again. Yeah. Okay. I didn't know that was there. That's interesting.

[00:25:07] Courtney Robertson: No, that was one of those like little hidden buried things I feel like, or it might have come out while they were sorting through what goes and what stays of real-time collab in this release.

[00:25:17] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. All right. Thank you. was there anything else from your article, which by the way I'll put into the show notes, Courtney, it's called WordPress 7.0, a provider agnostic AI client Lands in Core. Anything further down on that article that you wanted to mention? I just, I would say take some time and slowly dig through this one.

[00:25:38] Courtney Robertson: If you're one of the GoDaddy customers, it's gonna be linked inside of your WordPress website in the admin bar at the top. It will say what's new and take you over there, but take some time, sit with it for a bit because there are a lot of blocks that came through. the icon block certainly is one of them.

Yep. You'll want to look at on the AI connectors. we're seeing some chatter, Oliver from Patch Deck expressing concern of the security of the connectors. And then I saw Brian Cords asking, how is that different from storing a Stripe key in your database or some other things. So just take time with this.

There are a lot of kind of little buried things that came along and you'll wanna think about it really from a what's my use case and what's the use case If you're building sites for customers, what's their use case going to be? and I know that under that unsynced and synced patterns area, bud had some questions and Bud's probably gonna watch the replay.

Okay. We'll just call out to Bud. that's, in there of we made some changes in synced patterns and template parts. Go take a look and Okay. Be up to date. Yeah.

[00:26:43] Nathan Wrigley: do you know Courtney, I'm gonna use you as support very quickly. Sorry Mike. I'm just gonna ask Courtney a very quick question.

do you know Courtney, would this light box if I have, use the gallery block already, will it, does it do, I have to in instal, not instal? Do I have to use the new gallery block? Or will the old gallery block have this light box feature in it? Do you know by any chance?

[00:27:08] Courtney Robertson: I, do not.

[00:27:09] Nathan Wrigley: No, it's okay.

Alright. Over to you, Mike. Sorry.

[00:27:12] Mike Johnston: I, two, two thoughts about all of this. I'm glad Courtney, highlighted the pattern editing changes. I encountered that one yesterday and it was a terrifying experience. I'll have to say. I use a, I have a, pretty extensive template that I use for blog posts on my site with, headings and images and that sort of thing already baked in.

And when I opened it yesterday, everything was reduced to paragraphs and lists.

[00:27:44] Nathan Wrigley: Oh.

[00:27:45] Mike Johnston: and, I, spent, most of an hour reading support forums and chasing down things before I finally discovered, okay. Yeah, there's a switch that you can turn off in your config PHP file and that restores it the way it, you now, if you, go into an unsync pattern, you have to actually edit the pattern, okay.

to see what's really there. But you can turn that off so it reverts and that was lowered my blood pressure quite a bit. That

[00:28:23] Courtney Robertson: was the rabbit hole.

[00:28:25] Mike Johnston: Yeah. Oh man. I totally, the other

[00:28:27] Courtney Robertson: Mike, I tried to link for everybody that reads along where the track issues or the official dev notes were for each of these.

I know that this is a pretty technical long blog post, but for those that are, like what you were saying, there's track notes and little links out to dev notes all over the place for where the official info came from.

[00:28:48] Mike Johnston: Yeah. And I, it reflects the other, thing I wanted to say about this, which is really to, reinforce the appreciation, I think we all should have for the team that put this together, all 900 or so of them.

[00:29:06] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah.

[00:29:08] Mike Johnston: Yeah. And I'm certain that in what you might think of as a normal release that just runs smoothly, it's a major challenge, this one with big pieces being pulled out or being inserted at high speed and then pulled out at equally high speed. I can imagine the folks leading the project, Tearing their hair out and Yeah, and sweating a lot. And, just the fact that they, the fact that they delivered and delivered well, I think speaks to the, level of professionalism and commitment of the folks doing it. So a hat tip to them, multiple hat tips to them.

[00:29:53] Courtney Robertson: I think. I think on that note, Mike, a hat tip also to, in this case, the many hosts that got more involved on testing this.

Yeah. Because, I know that was something that Scott Clark, one of my coworkers that is also the lead DevOp pods, Scott and another coworker of mine, Jeff, were instrumental in testing how the performance would look of real time collaboration and having to, very succinctly describe, if we did it this way, it would go like this.

If we did it this other way, it would go like that. And what is that end impact on. Average customers, average user sites. And is this, like navigating that process was, interesting to be the voice of resistance a little bit there.

[00:30:43] Nathan Wrigley: I have a quick question about that. Do you, so this whole new dialogue stream, it feels opened up between hosts and, the, teams trying to push 7.0 out because potentially it was gonna cripple sites everywhere.

that really could have gone south pretty quickly if, let's say, I don't know, hosting company X's platform just wasn't managing to keep up with the concurrent requests and what have you. And so this, call went out to hosts and I think quite a lot of hosts responded. I don't know if you changed your posture at GoDaddy or if you got more involved or if it was just the same level of involvement, but I am curious to see whether that level of engagement keeps going into 7.1, 7.2, and so on.

[00:31:31] Courtney Robertson: I think that it will have to, so right. once upon a time, Kira Schroeder and Jason Cosper co-founded the.org hosting team. They were both employed at Dream Host at the time. both of them have moved on. Kira is working with me at GoDaddy these days. both of these fine folks helped co-found the hosting team and created a suite of test packages, test runners, if you will.

And, when at GoDaddy we got the word specifically from Jonathan De on the core team, who works at Blue Bluehost. I put together this test suite. Could you guys run it? Yes. we got it together to run it, for a number of releases. We were not running those tests and I was happy to see that was restored.

And in restoring it, what it does is it helps set the context that next release coming, now we restored it for our managed hosting. I'm really curious how folks are testing shared hosting environments and the performance for realtime collab on that one. but I think that moving forward it's easy to be able to point to that and say, ah, look, we caught this and this other thing because we reinstituted doing these test runners, right?

We found these other areas that would ensure our customers have good quality as well. And it did help empower our, my coworkers that specifically handled the hosting and deployment side. They're not day-to-day inside of WordPress itself, they're more focused on server config environment. But it did give them an easy onboarding spot to go right to the hosting team and provide that feedback.

And I think that's something that is a, I'm sad that we had a big feature that created such a delay. But at the same time, the good of having hosts engaging more because they recognise the product needs to evolve to stay strong in the market, and we need to serve our customers well in making that product really strong.

And the performance impacts would've been felt if we shipped as it was.

[00:33:33] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. I think it's, I think it's gonna be really interesting 'cause obviously at some point, collaborative editing is gonna come, and there was lots of intel which prevented it Arriving thus far. But I just wondered if more broadly across the hosting environment, the impact of people getting involved will be that more

[00:33:51] Courtney Robertson: Yeah.

[00:33:51] Nathan Wrigley: Hosts get involved and, wanna have their voice, because they don't wanna get left behind. And they don't wanna suddenly have a shock the day that 7.1 or 7.2, wherever it ships comes along. And, yeah. So that's lovely. I'm pleased to hear that. Yeah, that seems to have restored a lot of things that maybe you'd, lost touch with.

Okay. So that was 7.0. We had Courtney's article there, which I will link to in the show notes. but just a couple of other things. If, you are, if you've I don't know, got clients or something, and you wanna really dig into what's available in WordPress 7.0 for your clients, because we've just touched on a few of the, I don't know, the bits that we like best.

There are some, there's some lengthy work out there. So there was Courtney's piece, there's also this WordPress, it's on the Gutenberg Times. It's called the WordPress 7.0 Source of Truth. And there's the table of contents, which, gives you some idea of everything that's in here. But basically my guess is that if it's, in the release, there'll be something about it here, including screenshots and videos and basically all the bits and pieces that you need to know it.

There's a lot, there's many, words. And then also this one, if I can get it to load, there we go. the 14th of May, the WordPress 7.0 field guide. There's probably a fair bit of overlap here. I imagine, maybe Ray Cribs from this kind of documentation as well. Similar thing, just tells you about all the different bits and pieces, prior to arrival.

So again. I will link to all of these pieces in the show notes. When the newsletter drops in the morning, the first section will be about basically 7.0 and core and things. So all of the bits will be there. And then obviously Courtney's piece as well. So there we go.

[00:35:36] Courtney Robertson: I would encourage folks between now and the next beta release to at least keep eyes on when Gutenberg has their change logs.

They ship an update to the plugin every other week basically. And so I would be watching there because we know that the features that come to Core usually come in by way of starting over in Gutenberg first. So I would keep a watch on if you're tracking the real time collaboration or other things, noticing when it gets into Gutenberg plugin into their change log notes and decide if you want the Gutenberg plugin to test those features that will come on the next WordPress release.

Usually Gutenberg ships, everything that they have done every other week, they ship a release and then you bundle all of that together right before the WordPress release to drop it into

[00:36:22] Nathan Wrigley: court. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. that's great. Yep. Also,

[00:36:26] Mike Johnston: can Courtney s Sorry. No,

[00:36:28] Nathan Wrigley: Mike

[00:36:28] Mike Johnston: go.

[00:36:29] Nathan Wrigley: Please go

[00:36:29] Mike Johnston: Courtney. I'm just curious.

there was some conversation early on, about perhaps. Making real time collaboration, a canonical plugin Rather than a, an embedded piece of core. Do you know if that conversation has progressed any at all?

[00:36:49] Courtney Robertson: I don't, but I would point folks to, there is a channel in Make WordPress Slack that is feature dash.

I think it's collaboration or realtime collaboration, something like that. It's, it starts with feature dash and then I

[00:37:04] Nathan Wrigley: believe it's, yeah. Yeah. It feels to me like there's a, good argument for it to be a canonical plugin, but it, there also seems like a very strong argument that it shouldn't be, not, least that it's been talked about us coming in core for the longest period of time and the optics of suddenly, oh, no, we're not putting it in core.

That kind of seems

[00:37:23] Courtney Robertson: strange. Strange. It's been a, couple year, I feel like we heard Matt allude to Google Docs style revisions before Pandemic.

[00:37:35] Nathan Wrigley: yeah. That sounds right. Oh, this has been since Gutenberg Since before,

[00:37:37] Courtney Robertson: yeah. Like it was at State of the Word address.

[00:37:40] Nathan Wrigley: Yep.

[00:37:40] Courtney Robertson: In particular, or predating state of the word standalones.

[00:37:44] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah.

[00:37:44] Courtney Robertson: Yeah.

[00:37:45] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah.

it's been a long standing thing and I think Mike, if I had my way, I would probably make it canonical, because I would imagine a lot of people won't have any use for it. And it's just, those that do can get the hosting that they need, where they need it, and then switch it on.

maybe it's a nice badge that, for example, GoDaddy could have saying, yeah. we're full, sorry, collaborative editing ready? Just go for this plan and stick this canonical plugin in. yeah. Al also co Michelle's cat joined us, which, oh, it's gone now.

[00:38:22] Michelle Frechette: Yeah, she's gone back behind the monitor.

Oh, I was gonna say though, one of the things that I love about, and this is not have, has anything really to do with the software. Oh, she left a piece of hair behind. it's like floating in the air. But, I love the nomenclature for each, release. that it's a different, jazz musician.

I am just shocked that it took us this long to get to, to Louis Armstrong. and that the article, I don't think, I was just read it really quickly, never mentioned his nickname Satchmo, which was used so often instead of his actual name. And I just looked up the meaning of Satchmo in case you're curious, when he was a child, he got called Satchel mouth because he had such a wide smile that got show.

So there you go.

[00:39:13] Nathan Wrigley: That's a nice nickname.

[00:39:15] Michelle Frechette: It's

[00:39:16] Nathan Wrigley: I'm better than Big

[00:39:17] Michelle Frechette: Mouth.

[00:39:17] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, that's right. Yeah. I was like, you, I assumed that it, I thought that it would've been Armstrong would've been number two or something like that. he is just so famous. Yeah. But I

[00:39:29] Courtney Robertson: think especially with Hello Dolly in there.

[00:39:31] Nathan Wrigley: yeah, yeah. Exactly. but sometimes I think some of the, some of the jazz artists are a little bit more obscure. I think somebody somewhere likes to lean into oh, let's pick a, let's pick one that perhaps

[00:39:42] Michelle Frechette: know somebody's somewhere. I wonder

[00:39:44] Nathan Wrigley: if's Yeah, that's right.

Somebody

[00:39:46] Courtney Robertson: I have to wonder. It's like I, I almost envision, like a pin the tail on the donkey scenario of met with his vinyl albums and which jazzer are we going with today?

[00:39:59] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Oh,

[00:40:00] Michelle Frechette: he's got a giant like wheel like we do when we pick prizes at the end of award camp. All of them are in there.

Go and he's just spin that dial.

[00:40:07] Nathan Wrigley: Do you know what's interesting though? I wonder, looking back, I wonder if the point releases have bigger jazz names because Armstrong with seven it, I dunno if that's a thing. Anyway, so there

[00:40:22] Courtney Robertson: in two different ways of numbering releases. Okay. And I am not astute enough to even remember that, but in WordPress, I remember, oh, I think it was four and five, both because in WordPress three nine we got the administrator dashboard overhaul.

That was MP seven. And then, like we downplayed the four, I think got a lot of, maybe it was five. Five got hyped because of Gutenberg. Yes. Four was. Downplayed intentionally because it was basically just another release right on par with three nine and four one. And so in a sense, seven was treated the same.

So I'm not sure if the jazzer notoriety matches a no.

[00:41:11] Nathan Wrigley: I, I, you

[00:41:12] Courtney Robertson: know, I don't know.

[00:41:14] Nathan Wrigley: I doubt my, my son's a bit of a jazz musician, and so one day, there you

[00:41:19] Courtney Robertson: go.

[00:41:19] Nathan Wrigley: I'm hoping for there to be a WordPress 9.5 or something. Wrigley. I'm waiting, for Cab Callaway. He was from Rochester

and there's, an near Nathan.

You have

[00:41:33] Courtney Robertson: a, you have a whole baseball park here named after you.

[00:41:37] Nathan Wrigley: That's true.

[00:41:38] Courtney Robertson: So

[00:41:38] Nathan Wrigley: yeah. Okay. I'm being a bit selfish. Yeah.

[00:41:41] Michelle Frechette: A little

[00:41:44] Courtney Robertson: now to find a jazzer, huh?

[00:41:46] Nathan Wrigley: Let's look at the comments. I'm just gonna say hi to a few people. So we had a few people join us. So Nomad skateboarding Morning. Y'all really enjoyed Hello Mark Andrew and thank you.

Code episode Courtney. That's nice. What a nice, interesting. Yeah. good afternoon. Oh, we had that and then I made a comment about how it's like Australia love the humidity. Oh, this is not Australian. Says camera. Yeah, sorry. I was, it feels like it to me. Good evening from India. Hello. that's May my, and Cameron's back Ray is one of the best things to happen to WordPress.

Gosh.

[00:42:18] Michelle Frechette: Yeah, agree.

[00:42:18] Nathan Wrigley: Screenshot that and send it to Ray. That'll be a nice, she'll feel great. That's lovely. I'll leave it up. Got a few people. Oh, sorry. I'll leave it up there. There you go. Screenshot. I just wanted to

[00:42:28] Michelle Frechette: screenshot it.

[00:42:29] Nathan Wrigley: yeah. Get it, We'll send it to Ray.

[00:42:32] Michelle Frechette: Got

[00:42:32] Nathan Wrigley: it. Oh, there, nice. aia, good evening from Poon in India.

I, it's not Poon, is it? Pune. Pune. Okay.

[00:42:42] Michelle Frechette: Pune.

[00:42:43] Nathan Wrigley: I, so I was talking about the dashboard basically looking a bit blue. I believe the dashboard may look similar, but there are performance improvements. Okay. We glossed over that whole bit, but yes, there are lots of performance improvements and, I went for, it's a bit more blue.

There you go. That's the level of my expertise. the Slack channel name. Thank you. Yes,

[00:43:06] Mike Johnston: yes.

[00:43:07] Courtney Robertson: Thank you.

[00:43:07] Nathan Wrigley: the smack slack, the smack channel I just called.

[00:43:10] Courtney Robertson: we're gonna

[00:43:11] Nathan Wrigley: talk smack in that

[00:43:12] Courtney Robertson: channel.

[00:43:13] Nathan Wrigley: Slack channel name is, so hashtag feature dash realtime dash collaboration. So go and check that out if you want me.

[00:43:20] Mike Johnston: And that's a name that would be top of mind for all of us, Right. That's right. Yes. It's embedded. It's gonna be a constant study. It's up there, from now on. ba Anything else? somebody here saying I love Cab Callaway.

[00:43:37] Michelle Frechette: It's Michelle.

[00:43:38] Nathan Wrigley: That's Michelle. Oh, hello. It's Michelle. I can tell from the, from the picture.

It's before

[00:43:42] Michelle Frechette: the photo. Yeah,

[00:43:42] Nathan Wrigley: isn't it? Yeah. That's nice. It's Hello Michelle. She loves Cab Callaway. She says it's Heidi Ho. Nice to have you with us. That's lovely. Okay, let's move on. So we'll just go to this one very quickly, but without a great deal of time to dwell on it. If you, if you fancy a, it's not a particularly long article, if I just scroll through it, you can be done with this in five minutes, but I don't have the time to go into it.

But, this is Ronak Van Puria again, sorry if I've butchered your name. and it's called Technical Postmortem. Why Realtime Collaboration was pulled from WordPress 7.0. And I'll just read a very quick, quick summary of that. this article explains why realtime collaboration was delayed due to the state desynchronization race conditions and server scaling bottlenecks.

so you can go and, nerd out as much as you like, but, there's an article explaining exactly why it was all postponed. Okay, let's move on to this. This, honestly, I don't even know what was going on in the water over Automatic, but basically it sounds like a lot of people were just given a chance over the last month to do whatever they like.

And I don't know if that means literally stop doing your day job or here's 50% of your time available. I, don't know the numbers, but lots and lots of people at Automatic were basically told no guardrails. Find somebody. I think most of it was partner work. Maybe there was people who were doing this solo, but I think a lot of it seems to be done with partners.

and then just build something I. We need that. that's such a cool thing to have done. like that whole thing of, okay, there's no checklist of who you've got to report to and whether or not it's worth building. The intuition was do you wish to do it? And if the answer to that was yes, then you were allowed to do it.

Now that period of time, I think, is now over, because Ray, again, we're back at the repository as an article entitled Automatics Radical Speed Month wraps up with cast payment and publishing tools among 400 plus projects. My guess is most of these projects will not see the light of day. They'll end up in the sort of trash can of history, however, some of them will.

But I also imagine curious ideas that will then germinate into other products will have come about that would never have existed were it not for this. Partnerships will have been formed. A meets B, they get along really well and they discover that, they just wanna collaborate again in the future and what have you.

But, Mike, you surfaced this one. Was there, was there some projects in this that you, that took your fancy particularly?

[00:46:42] Mike Johnston: I wanna talk about my initial reaction to it and my later reaction to it. When I first heard about this at the beginning of the month, it, it, just raised all sorts of red flags for me.

coming out of, a big part of my career was shepherding. Major it programmes from start to finish, and the whole notion of build fest and break things just was not a part of that ethos. It was test the living crap out of everything before you ever take it live.

[00:47:17] Nathan Wrigley: I like that.

[00:47:18] Mike Johnston: And, the notion of let's just go make a whole bunch of stuff without any guardrails and throw it out there happening at the same time as realtime collaboration was being forced, marched through the, programme, and then realising, oh, wait a minute, that's not ready.

Pull that back. I just, it scared me when I first read about it. Now, to be fair, having read this article and seen things, what really impressed me was how many of the things, to your point, Nathan, were really labelled as experimental. they're not being released. They're still being looked at or there's some things that are being fine tuned and may get released and, yes, there's a thing or two in there that I'm waiting to see because I want it, the core text.

Yeah. Open source knowledge base built entirely in WordPress. Yeah. It was like, that fills a need I've got today. So please bring that to the fore.

[00:48:24] Nathan Wrigley: Right.

[00:48:25] Mike Johnston: okay. Yeah, This was, I

[00:48:27] Courtney Robertson: didn't, I didn't have a go ahead opportunity to read through all of it, Mike, but you are more familiar with this article.

Do you know if anyone picked projects that were existing products that have been shelved? that's something I was oh, I don't know if the sensei team is as active as they used to. I've seen Ronnie get pivoted to a few other things since Ronnie was on Sensei, which is their learning management system.

So I was curious to know if any of the, like one of the products that you mentioned in here was a jet pack feature, I believe. did other, yeah. It jet

[00:49:04] Nathan Wrigley: pack podcasts. Yeah.

[00:49:06] Courtney Robertson: Yeah. Do you happen to know Mike if other products that they offer were, that are like perhaps not as currently developed, got more love and attention.

[00:49:15] Mike Johnston: I'm sorry, Courtney. I don't,

[00:49:17] Courtney Robertson: it's alright. Can

[00:49:18] Nathan Wrigley: I

[00:49:18] Courtney Robertson: just

[00:49:18] Nathan Wrigley: chip in there? I had

[00:49:19] Courtney Robertson: that earlier.

[00:49:19] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Having read the article, and obviously we're bound by what Ray chose to highlight here. I didn't get that intuition. Okay. this felt like everybody ran with it as I think I would as well. If I was an aian, I'd be like, okay, shiny and new.

that, that would probably be the way my, my head would go. And so I don't know if anybody resurrected, if anybody in the comments, has some sort of further intuition on that. What, yeah, that's an interesting point though, Courtney. Why not? polish the thing, which has been sat for a while and going a little bit stale now.

I don't think that happened. the one that Mike mentioned, what was it, cortex or context? I can't remember. Cor core cortex. Yeah. that was one of the project. Here it is. We're just listing it here. That was, Hector Preto and me, Mewell Fonseca. so this is core text, an open source knowledge base built entirely in WordPress with the tagline, your digital brain, your rules.

so that'll be interesting. The one that in the space that I occupy, the one that resonated most for me was, Jetpack podcasts. Which is, why hasn't Jetpack done this years ago? It, like, all of the bits were available in Jetpack, they just, the knots never got tied. So that's now shipped.

That's,

[00:50:48] Michelle Frechette: I see, that's available. Dot com though. I Is it also available

[00:50:52] Nathan Wrigley: with.com?

[00:50:53] Michelle Frechette: Yeah, with.com,

[00:50:54] Nathan Wrigley: yeah. and they're leaning into their.com hosting a lot. So a lot of those things are gonna probably show up on wordpress.com, because that's where they're making a lot of, make the most of the money for automatic, probably.

Yeah. That's interesting. Let me see if I can find it. 'cause there is a link here somewhere. No, I, it's got buried. I don't really know where it's gone, but, anyway, you can get that podcasting feature if, you are a, let's go with.com. I think you're right, Michelle, on that. if you're a.com subscriber already, you've now it's all there.

It's ready to roll. And that a month ago didn't exist, even though most, I think of the architecture was already, in existence. And yeah, so have a look at this article. You'll see obviously what Ray has picked. There's loads of different bits and pieces. I won't mention them all. but there's absolutely loads of stuff that has reached a point of maturation where at least it's, it's surface for its human consumption.

Jonathan Boser has been on this show quite a few times. He gets special mention for being like the superhero. I think he managed to get him off on three projects or something like that, which is, pretty astonishing. So go check that out. We've got a comment related to that. I think, my son did a side project when Oculus Rift came out.

This later became e Valkyrie, which was released as part of the PlayStation Oculus pack. Is that, to do with the I'm not, I don't see the connection there. Sorry. neuros. So

[00:52:22] Michelle Frechette: you're talking about side projects that got incorporated into Oh,

[00:52:25] Nathan Wrigley: I see. Of course. Yeah, that was a famous thing about Google, wasn't it, for the longest time as well.

I think Google, if you were an employee, a developer over there for the first few years, then you would be given 20% one day a week or something like that to, to do this kind of work. But I, anyway, there you go. So Mike, thanks for bringing that article to our attention.

[00:52:46] Mike Johnston: I think you're, you made a point earlier, Nathan, that I think will have long-term benefit for automatic, and that was the notion of people getting together who might not have worked together before and, establishing some new, some new partnerships.

the Google thing, if it's, you've got 20% of your time to go off on your own and do something that doesn't, perhaps it broadens your horizon, but it doesn't broaden your circle of contacts.

[00:53:16] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. encouraging, interesting that collaboration is a good thing, I think.

Yeah. a sort of hidden consequence of this, and I dunno how much the automations feel this, I wonder what sense you get of the company automatic from this.

What I mean is, I'm gonna really struggle to put this into words, so I'll try my best. Like, how favourably do you view your employer off the back of that trust. Because that, that, that's cost automatic a tonne of money. let's be serious. I'm sure that they're playing it forward and hoping that some of these turn into, just some sort of amazing thing in the future.

I imagine there's a bit of that, right? But that must be millions of dollars that's been sunk into what could have been an absolute disaster. nothing of any interest got shipped, nobody got along. It was all just a black hole. It could have gone in that direction. And the fact that there was no constraints over what you could build, I think that'll be interesting to see how that changes the calculus for automations and automatics been in a period of flux these last couple of years.

Be interesting to see how that plays into the psyche over there. Did I sum up that? did you capture what I was trying to say there? A little bit. Did that Yeah. Ish. Yes. Okay. Great. Thank you. I think these projects, so this is my an I think these are projects that automatic either built in-house, open source, or took over.

my understanding, my ANK is most of them were kinda like made up off the cuff, so That's at least what I thought that most of these were not projects that had any, backstory. But Myan, if I'm wrong, let me know. I'd be interested to, to know what you think. Okay, let's move on. ai, we can't avoid it.

It's everywhere. for the longest period of time, like couple of years now, AI stuff has been happening like every week. Fairly seismic things going on. And a lot of it has been under the stewardship of James LaPage. James was brought in, I think his plugin, WPAI was acquired by automatic. I don't exactly know what happened there.

but James was brought like an acquihire, and he became the, head of the AI stuff going on automatic. He's left automatic now. I dunno if that means that he's gonna continue con contributing in his own spare time where the WordPress is still significant. But, James has left and then co maybe not, I'm not sure.

also Felix s has also stepped down, so James has stepped down as the, team co-req for the AI team. Felix has done the same, so obviously we need new stewardship over there. But the additional piece I suppose is that James has also stepped down from automatic, whereas Felix, was working for Google until, I'm gonna say six months ago, something like that, and then Went to work for Vasel, and has been volunteering his time gratis for the last eight months or whatever it may be. Anyway, big changes afoot. James has been pushing with Felix a lot of rapid change, so it'd be interesting to see what the pace is like over there. So I'll just open that up if anybody's got anything on that.

[00:56:45] Courtney Robertson: I think Felix will still stay peripherally attached. I know that in the Versal space, folks are, the Versal community tends to be much more dev forward, and they saw the news of the plugin that Felix helped create for Versal. this one is an AI gateway, so this will allow you with one Versal connection to, if you scroll down a bit, Nathan.

They list the current, AI providers that they connect with. You'll see that there's a dozen of them listed there. Andro, Amazon, chate, perplexity some more. so I'm wondering if the work at Versal that Felix will be doing in the future will be connected to WordPress, but perhaps he's not leading the AI team.

Okay. but it's still adjacent. And I know that the announcement of this plugin, typically in, in the Versal community, they're like, WordPress is old. PHP is dead long live PHP. So that's good. That's my own addition is some of the tech world likes to still frown upon WordPress and or PHP, but in reality, it's got a lot going for it when you look at some of the newer CMSs that come along and have a lot yet of infrastructure and user experiences to still develop.

[00:58:09] Nathan Wrigley: So firstly, James, good luck with whatever it is that you are doing. Yeah. congratulations for whatever it is that you've managed to secure. Maybe you are taking a break. I don't know. and also thank you and thank you to Felix, although we did that on a previous episode. But anyway, so new stewardship, we've got to find some new leadership.

I, I, don't know like how anybody even vaguely steps into that role. Yeah. It like, feels like your job description is completely upended every three months. so anyway, may maybe that contributed to the, departure. It's just it's hard to keep up with those kind of things. Okay. So there we go.

That was that piece. Let's move on quickly. so WordPress, it's a never ending cycle. it never stops. The juggernaut that is WordPress seven has just shipped. 7.1 call for volunteers has been announced. If that feels like you, if you're curious about putting your, feet in the sand of helping out get 7.1, there are so many things that you can be involved with and, you probably wanna know how much time it would consume and when the bits, when it all starts to materialise, all that hard work.

So the alpha phase, the alpha phase, has already begun. The beta phase is beginning on the 15th of July, and if you can see the screen here, there's this sort of cascading weekly set of deadlines going through beers and then release candidates. And the final expectation is that WordPress 7.1 would ship on the 19th of August, which is a Wednesday.

But if you want to, at least find out a little bit more, go to, the article. It's called WordPress 7.1, call for volunteering. at the bottom is more information about how you actually can help out. Anybody wanna comment on that? No. Okay. In which case, I will quickly move on. I am so pleased about this.

I use quite a lot of media. I've dabbled with a lot of WordPress websites and media, like images in particular. It's mainly images. and the media library like eight years ago felt great. Now it, it definitely feels like it needs a bit of attention. One of the things that I do a lot is crop images and fiddle with images, rotate images, blah, blah, blah.

There's just a load of that kind of stuff. And you really, there's this disconnect. You have to go to this other place, do the thing, save it, put it back in the post, whatever, all of that. This is neat. So this is called, media editor modal. And it's a call for testing. Can I urge everybody to test this so that it's just shipped into call?

'cause it's great. you interact with the media in question inside the post or the page as a modal. There's not really much for me to say other than that. You can crop things, rotate things, all the things that you can normally do. Only this time it happens in a modal. If you're looking at the screen, let me just quickly, there you go.

You can see the post editor in the background here. Somebody's clicked on this image of a house and then all the editing work is just done right in the post. And you click save and it's, whatever it is that you needed to do is done. I want this yesterday. so yeah, there we go. There's my little plea.

Get on that. Yeah, that's right. Everybody, can you all do the call? Fantastic, please. So that

[01:01:35] Michelle Frechette: Nathan needs it now.

[01:01:36] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, because yeah, that's right. Yeah. Last week. In fact. can you do

[01:01:40] Michelle Frechette: it yesterday?

[01:01:41] Nathan Wrigley: It's one of those little, what do they call it when something is just so incremental? It's not really on anybody's agenda.

It's like a, anyway, it's one of those that will make everybody's lives infinitely better. so yeah. Can we have it please? There we go. Moving on. We're back to the repository again. Here's another thing I never thought I needed, but now need. So what, even, where did this come from? This is so great.

WordPress gets an official browser extension testers wanted ahead of 1.0. Can you see the thread running through this episode? It's like loads of new stuff we need testing. so this is Jake Goldman, who was in charge of, now let me get this right. It was 10 OP and it's now fueled. Yeah, I think he's still in charge at Fueled.

He's one of the partners over there. they've come up with this, great little WordPress extension for, I'm gonna say Chrome. If it's for something else, forgive me, but I imagine it's safari. Is it Safari as well? Oh yeah. Great. Yeah, you're right, sari right there. That's brilliant. and it allows you to do a fairly simple set of things.

you can see it, you invoke it. You can click things like edit page, you can go straight into the WordPress admin, you can log out and all of those kind of things. And you can add some new things. So if there's typically something that you already do and you just can't be bothered to go through the whole UI of WordPress to get there.

Now obviously if you're a bit of a nerd, you can remember the URL of how to do that thing, that's fine. But in this situation you'll be able to lock away some of the more used bits. And also my understanding, and I, forgive me if I've paused this wrong, does it get rid of some of the WordPress admin ui, like the top bar as well, so that this in effect, replaces that?

I dunno if that's true. I have a memory that I read something about that in the article. But anyway, a great thing. I didn't think I needed it. Now I want it. So can we have this as well?

[01:03:51] Michelle Frechette: All the things I want.

[01:03:53] Nathan Wrigley: All

[01:03:53] Michelle Frechette: the things.

[01:03:54] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, That's right. anybody wanna comment on that? If not, I will move on.

[01:03:58] Michelle Frechette: I love some of the different extensions that people have built. There's one by WP Optic, which lets you just click a little button and know, you know exactly whether it's a WordPress site and what Oh, Nice.

What's on it like, so it'll tell you if there's, plugins and what theme and that kind of stuff.

And I love that one. And this one sounds like it's even a step further, which is cool.

[01:04:20] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah.

[01:04:21] Michelle Frechette: So you can have your analytical tools and you can have your creativity tools all in one.

[01:04:24] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, that's right. I think this is just the kind, because I'm in WordPress literally all day, every day.

Any way that I can create a little shortcut is really, helpful. And with that in mind, I dunno if, the three of you saw recently, there's this idea of WordPress as a desktop app, right? There's this idea of being able to like, I don't know, atomize. So inside the browser screen, you split off little windows like Mac Os.

And so you'd put your media library over there and the post that you're working on sits over there and then you can drag media into the post from the media library that

[01:05:03] Courtney Robertson: I've seen Mattias pictures of that. Yeah.

[01:05:05] Nathan Wrigley: Oh, if someone,

[01:05:07] Courtney Robertson: that was what Mattias was working on for Speed Build, I believe. Yeah. Okay.

Mattias put some, Mattias Ventura put some photos out or screenshots of it on his ex account, I think. And he even went so far as to have like workflow lines running between them. I don't know if he's full on N eight N style, where you like visually draw your workflow with it. But it did look interesting.

I'll say

[01:05:33] Nathan Wrigley: I would, stop using the regular UI for WordPress the instant that was stable. I can see so many uses for that. because typically I have four browser windows that can't communicate with each other for the four or five things that I'm doing simultaneously. So the media uploading and modification, the creating of a post and the checking an old post to make sure that the new one is a little bit like that one, or that it links to that one or what have you.

If I could have that, that to me is supremely cool. I really hope that one comes off. So that was Ventura right?

[01:06:12] Courtney Robertson: Yes.

[01:06:13] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. Okay. Let's hope he pulls that. it is, it's not like he's got much else going on, is it? No.

[01:06:20] Courtney Robertson: Not a busy person at all.

[01:06:22] Nathan Wrigley: No, no pressure whatsoever. okay. There we go. ba babu.

We've got some little comments here. What's this one about? This is, oh, firstly we got some important weather, updates. It's, weather. Yeah. Yeah. 13 degrees. Ha. I laugh at your 13 degrees. Sorry, that was rude, wasn't it? it's only because this is only because this is the only hot day that we'll get this year.

It's 29 here at the moment. Fully three times hotter than where you are. but hello, nice to have you with us, James. Thank you. and my ang is staying the final release for 7.1 is a couple of weeks before Word camp us. I hope it doesn't get delayed. There was that whole thing, wasn't there recently about word, like flagship word camps, coinciding with, with these flagship events like the release cycle coinciding so that we could have that big red button kind of moment.

But that seems to have taken a bit of a backseat recently. WordPress dashboard becomes like post hog website. What do you mean by that? I'll have to pause that a little bit. I'll have a think. Nick Hamey, released ODD, which is a skin for. Apps for the entire thing. Meta. What? That's a what? apps on top of this os now.

Really? Yeah.

[01:07:46] Mike Johnston: It was like a, a marketplace, wasn't it?

[01:07:51] Nathan Wrigley: I wanna, I, there's a bit of me which wants to just for 10 minutes, I wanna know what the inside of Nick Hamley's brain like.

[01:08:01] Courtney Robertson: No.

[01:08:02] Nathan Wrigley: For 10 minutes. 'cause I don't know if I'm gonna be able to back out of that. he's just, where does his in I, He's just one of those curious people that seems to be replete with ideas and they never seem to dry up. Yeah. That's amazing. Okay. Thank you for that. da duh. Oh, thank you. That's very You're welcome. Hi,

[01:08:23] Courtney Robertson: Tara.

[01:08:24] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. it says thank you for the 7.0 overview. Very helpful. You are so welcome.

Okay. Shall we move on? So anyway, that was the browser extension, which then led to talk of something else. Just wanna give a bit of a hat tip to the folk over at Generate press. Generate. Press have, have been fairly opinionated. They've got a, really cool set of blocks called Generate Blocks, but they've also got a theme, which they've had for years and years called Generate Press.

And, the theme is a classic theme and there's been a lot of talk recently about, why would you still consider using a classic theme when we've got all these block-based themes and full site editing and all of that? And I suppose at some point a company like Generate Press have to justify themselves and explain the case for why they think shipping a classic theme into the future is the way forward.

And that's what this is. Basically, they say that as things stand, I won't go into too many details, but as things stand, they are constrained by, things like the HTML output and the CSS and the conditional logic that they can apply if they, you, if they became a full site editing theme. And if you've ever tried to, I don't know, wonder why they might want to stick with the a classic theme.

This is their article. And actually I applaud them for it. They're, they know what their business model is, they know who their customers are, they've got solid reasons for not going, block-based. And so they explain them all performance and so on. So if you're one of their customers, and I don't know, it's maybe occurred to you to look elsewhere, maybe have a read of this and it might convince you of the, the benefits of sticking with there.

Classic theme. I dunno if anybody's got anything on that. Probably not.

[01:10:17] Mike Johnston: I'd like to comment on it real quickly. Oh,

[01:10:19] Nathan Wrigley: sure.

[01:10:19] Mike Johnston: I use generate press the whole, suite of products and have for a couple years and every time I've gone into full site editing to, to look at, look at what's possible over there, I walk away and go, wait a minute.

I can do more in generate press, particularly around, managing the, CSS attributes of things and, even some of the things that were announced as part of 7.0. when I read that, I went, wait a minute. You're just now getting to that. I've had that already. not, don't hear me dinging 7.0 and, full side editing.

But, they're on, they're on two different tracks. I'll leave with

[01:11:09] Nathan Wrigley: that. Yeah, no, I think that's really nice of you as one of their customers to just corroborate that because obviously, all the news at the moment in the, in the WordPress media, I suppose is about the new shiny stuff.

And so I suppose it, it becomes quite hard for companies like generate press blocks, generate one to paint, to put their flag in the sand and say, look, this is why we're doing it. We actually think we've got a credible business case for keeping things this way. We know there's that shiny new thing over there, but there's no end in sight for classic themes, so there's no reason to changeover.

And, you can go and look at the technical argument of this for yourself and, obviously in Mike's case, it corroborates in the real world. So that's nice to hear it,

[01:11:58] Mike Johnston: it answered the question for me when this article came out. I went, that's the question I've been trying, I've been wanting to hear an answer for, Why has, why aren't they going down this full site editing

[01:12:10] Nathan Wrigley: right

[01:12:10] Mike Johnston: path?

[01:12:11] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Yeah. that's nice to hear. I presume that they'll very much enjoy the fact that you have said exactly that. and lean into

[01:12:20] Courtney Robertson: that one. similar, a different, instead of generate press, headway came out also recently.

I'm sorry, not headway. Wow. Sorry about that. Oh, that's going back a while, isn't it? beaver Builder, which was the next theme I went to after that. beaver Builder just announced that they are supporting, they have beta two available for two point 11, beta two is now available, and it, supports the font library that came out in WordPress seven.

So when you go to appearance, you'll see fonts as an option on all WordPress seven sites. Now you're starting to see some of the other themes similar to what Generate Press is doing. they know their target audience. They know how to go about things. There are people that still absolutely love Beaver Builder and won't be moving away anytime soon from it.

And it's good to see where they're finding ways, avenues in of. Taking advantage of what some of the things are that WordPress has to offer that don't live inside of full site editing specifically anymore.

[01:13:24] Nathan Wrigley: I, I suppose the, difficult thing for generate press, et al that the pe the companies that are doing that classic theme and doing it really well and have got a customer base, is they're gonna have to continue to make sure that they're doing this messaging.

Because as, full site editing and block-based, this, that, and the other become more credible and maybe there's feature parity at some point it'll be interesting to see how, they market that into their existing user base so that they basically don't haemorrhage it over time because everybody likes shiny, and new.

So anyway. Bravo. This is David. this is one of the older ones, but I thought this was worth it worth including, we got some

[01:14:09] Michelle Frechette: comments about it too.

[01:14:11] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. Thank you. Alright, let's have a look. so no mud skateboarding. Apologies, Courtney. It's completely obliterated you. Oh no. We can get rid of that by doing that.

There we go. Oh no, that didn't help. hold on. There's a setting for this somewhere. No, Look there. Yay. Look at that. I applaud them for it as well. regarding generate press, but I would respectfully disagree with most of their conclusions. My analogy would be selling a gas car to someone without me mentioning electric exists.

Interesting. Thank you Nomad Skateboarding. Appreciate that. Cameron says, full sight editing isn't suitable for every site and particularly not for agencies. And sticking with the technical theme, it is 73 degrees Fahrenheit in Cary. That

[01:15:00] Courtney Robertson: is Adam. Thank you Adam.

[01:15:03] Nathan Wrigley: I wanna, say North Carolina, but a big part of me was gonna say North Connecticut, but I don't think Connecticut's big enough to have a north, is it?

[01:15:10] Courtney Robertson: and it's definitely not 73 in Connecticut today.

[01:15:14] Nathan Wrigley: Alright. and oh, somebody's paying attention, headway. he's mocking

[01:15:21] Courtney Robertson: me because he and I met each other in the headway community.

[01:15:25] Nathan Wrigley: Oh. And Nomad skateboarding again, headway was my favourite. That was so far ahead of its time. It wasn't it?

It was amazing until bl a decade

[01:15:36] Courtney Robertson: before,

[01:15:37] Nathan Wrigley: didn't it? My me my memory of it was, it just basically got abandoned, didn't it? Things moved on. People sold things, I can't remember, but it was all very mucky. Yeah. And murky. You can

[01:15:47] Courtney Robertson: head over to the tavern and check out the archives for the history of headway.

[01:15:53] Nathan Wrigley: yeah. Was definitely amazing.

[01:15:54] Courtney Robertson: Enjoy some good tavern comments from

[01:15:57] Nathan Wrigley: yesterday

[01:15:57] Courtney Robertson: year.

[01:15:59] Nathan Wrigley: And then, so back to a moment ago, a you. Saying Nathan, what I meant. Oh, Thank you. In regard to your Postoc comment, what I meant was the postdoc homepage behaves like a desktop with things on it. Oh, I see.

Something like Mattia shipped experimentally. yeah. Okay. So if you can interact with the bits on the page. Yeah. basically this was just bits of WordPress, like you're at, you've, I don't know, you've just got a tab with the admin over here, and then you've got the media library over here, and you've got the current post that you're editing over there.

That was it. But they were all in one browser window and you could move things between them that honestly, if Mathias pulls that off, I am, I'm sold. And, here we go. rivalry of the weather.

[01:16:44] Michelle Frechette: Oh my gosh.

[01:16:46] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. That's brutal. aia it was almost that here, I wanna say about a week ago we were into the nineties.

[01:16:56] Courtney Robertson: That, but then it went down to, right now it's 14 or 16 Celsius out. I'm learning for the rest of the globe. I am not gonna be the lazy American. I've forced myself after watching Raquel do this, I told my weather apps to all use Celsius so that I have to learn.

[01:17:16] Nathan Wrigley: It's,

such a good unit. It's, one of my favourite weather units of all time.

Yeah. the Dear Celsius. so there we go. If you two are experiencing hot weather, that puts my hot weather into some kind. That's, that is hot. I should read it into the record for those listening on audio only. a you's saying that it's 37 degrees centigrade there, which in Fahrenheit is so much Fahrenheit.

98 is what? It's, that's just all the big numbers. It's nearly three digits of Fahrenheit. It feels like that's getting a bit unsafe. Stay in aha. Don't go too near. You'll get burned on the sun. And here we go. Headway was one of the first OG WP dramas. Yes. I feel like it was a drama mix of which we no longer have.

Things have calmed down a little bit since then. There was all sorts going on. totally with you. Nomad skateboarding. It says Run Adam. Run Adam Run. Okay. It was way ahead of its time. It totally was in the last six months. Matic says in the last six months, 50% of themes submitted to the theme directory were classic.

Is that true? If that's true, that is absolutely amazing. I did not know that. If you can tell me where that's, where that factor's come from, I'd be fascinated to follow that up. That's really interesting. Wow. Okay. I'll believe you. I'm gonna totally take it on your word, How much time have we got left?

Not a lot, in which case, 10 minutes. We're just, yeah, we're just gonna rip through some of this stuff and not give it the attention it deserves. If you're a modular DS user, it's like a platform that you can use to update all of your WordPress websites. they've released their 3.0 release, and I'll just do the quick headline items.

malware scanning has now been introduced with, unify, which I confess I hadn't heard of before. Find and fix broken links, new global management schemes, bulk site import, and more. Let's leave it at that. but if you're one of their users, no doubt that will be of significance to you. This is so interesting.

Introducing Block MCP, the WordPress MCP we built because nothing else worked It, firstly, is that true? Did nothing else work? But anyway, it obviously didn't work as well as Gravity Kit needed it to. and I'll just read the, sort of headline, you go and check this out, it's genuinely an interesting piece.

Block MCP is the WordPress MCP server we built to let AI agents edit posts at the block level. That's the point without breaking the block structure. So basically this, there's a little diagram here which kind of sums it up perfectly most. I think it's fair to say that most things, if let's say you're creating a post, if you want an AI to interact with that, it's gonna just react at the post level.

Like all of the posts will be under the purview of that. But the block, a block level, there's comments which identify this is a paragraph, this is a, an image, whatever it may be. And the AI may not know that context and it might strip those out and it just destroys your post. So what this, will do is this will declare this bit is a heading, this bit is a paragraph.

Treat it as such. This is an image, this is another paragraph and what have you. And so it's a really different, necessary I would say, approach. So yeah, I dunno if anybody's got anything on that, but I thought that was quite novel. and therefore quite useful. So yeah, okay. Nobody's got anything on that.

That by the way, was by, gravity Kit. links in the show notes tomorrow when it comes out. I had a quick chat with Leslie from Event coi. she along with, oh my goodness, what's her collaborator's name? I've forgotten. I am so sorry. Anyway, her collaborator, they produced event coi, I don't know, 18 months ago or something like that.

They've now got it on lifetime deal. So if that was a plugin that piqued your interest, it's, think Eventbrite or something like that. Insider WordPress, that's what they do. And they've now got it on a lifetime deal, 23 days, the clock is ticking. So go check that out. We really are running through these at a clip.

I also got a message from Robert Abella from Mail Press. They have their state of WordPress 2026 security survey, which they're trying to get Intel from the wider community. the, URL for it is impossible to the read into the record. So I'm just gonna say go and check it out. Google it mailer press, 2026 WordPress security survey.

and I'll put the link in the show notes 'cause it's a jumble of nonsense if I try to read it out. Lastly towards events, not quite last, but, WordCamp Europe, is obviously happening. Next week's, what is it? Probably at 12 day, 10 days, something like that from now, the schedule has now been, I think, Batten down subject to some, calamities.

This is probably gonna see, or here. So if you are gonna go to that, then you can now go here. What I particularly like about this webpage is if, you are, if you're into bookmarking things, you can just star things and as you go around starring things, I wanna see that, I wanna see that, I wanna see that.

And then you click this, like on here, it'll send you an email with all of the presentations that you want to go and see in which are neat little feature. Just thought that was quite nice. So go check it out. I know that Mike's gonna be there, so hopefully I'll see Mike at that event. I'm rushing. I do apologise, but I want to get through most of these.

that one we just did. I dunno why that's on the same page twice. Nevermind, word Camp Canada. has just put out a call for speakers. It's actually quite a bit older than this now, so it was a co several weeks ago, but I never got to cover it, so I thought I would now. So if you're interested and from that part of the world and you want to be part of that event, go check it out.

And an online event, WordPress, WP SW Swami 2026 is also looking for some sponsorship. So that wraps up, I think our events coverage. And lastly, I dropped this one in specifically for Courtney 'cause I know that Courtney is an obsidian user.

[01:23:42] Courtney Robertson: I am a

[01:23:42] Nathan Wrigley: fan. I'm so close to being obs an obsidian user. The problem with obsidian is I get into it and I have no, I can't figure out where the heck I am.

I know it's good and I'm like so close to making enough connections that, oh, this is necessary to me now.

[01:24:00] Courtney Robertson: so if people are not familiar with obsidian, it is a, piece of software that lets you read your markdown files, right? It is your own markdown files. No matter what you do. It is not open source.

Although many of the plugins that support it are, the software is maintained by three engineers total and they aspire to stay small and they have, a couple of tools that you could pay for. If you wanna just donate money to this piece of software, you could do that. Although they also have obsidian sync and obsidian publish.

Yeah. Yeah. Sync lets you, keep your documents synchronised across all your devices and it does it better, dare I say, than the other options. You could still completely for free go get obsidian the software and still find other ways. Like some people use GitHub. I've heard of some people even using, the Microsoft OneDrive storage options, other ways of synchronising their files and publish lets you basically put your, we call them vault entirely on the web.

Think of it like your personal knowledge base or archive. So organising it, Nathan is only as good as the user that is saving these files. So making folders and things is

[01:25:17] Nathan Wrigley: therein lies the problem. Courtney?

[01:25:20] Courtney Robertson: Yeah. Helpful. Although you can get AI to help you with some of those connections these days, but what exactly does this plugin do?

Tell me about this one. 'cause I, this is

[01:25:28] Nathan Wrigley: maybe, so basically, as far as I'm aware, this syncs the, bits and pieces that are in your markdown file so that WordPress becomes the, sort of fulcrum of it all.

[01:25:39] Courtney Robertson: Okay.

[01:25:40] Nathan Wrigley: so that you can edit the bits and pieces inside of WordPress. And to be honest with you, I'm not like, I, recognise the benefits of using markdown, but for me, I would rather click a button to get an H one than do whatever, keyboard shortcut would be required in.

But the markdown, the, saved file of that is just beautifully simple, right? There's just everything is in front of you. There's no metadata, there's nothing hidden behind the scenes. What is what you get. And so syncing that through something like Google Drive to your obsidian network, so your phone or your other laptop or whatever it may be, like, the chances of that going wrong is it significantly diminished because the file is the file and that's it.

There's no hidden thing anywhere. but I dunno, I can't pull the trigger because I just, I wanna be able to have that kind of Gutenberg type interface. And so maybe, this will push me over the edge. So I'm gonna go and have a look at that and

[01:26:49] Courtney Robertson: Nathan, Cameron, Nathan and I are due to hang out and I will show you where the settings are.

The, just the same as you can write in a markdown in WordPress and not do the click around, right? You could just use markdown there. Likewise, over an obsidian, you can use a more gooey approach to things. You don't have to know markdown. And think in Mark down, we'll hang

[01:27:10] Nathan Wrigley: out. Okay? Alright. When's hang out and you can, yeah.

Yeah. You'll honestly, I am not an ideal student. I get stroppy quickly. okay. And Cameron, thank you so much. I dunno why I didn't mention it. It was on the list of things to mention. W-P-L-D-N, of course, that was my fourth and event that somehow got pushed off. The, roster, is coming up. in fact, it's on Thursday.

And guess who's speaking? it'd be Cameron. Cameron is gonna be, oh, let's get rid of all this. This is meet up for you, isn't it? what a platform it is. Will

[01:27:45] Courtney Robertson: he be speaking about rugby while he's there?

[01:27:47] Nathan Wrigley: No. Cricket. It's cricket that he's into. Oh,

[01:27:49] Courtney Robertson: cricket, I'm sorry.

[01:27:50] Nathan Wrigley: no, here we go. Cameron is gonna be talking about, it says how we automated migrating thousands of blog posts from flexible content to the block editor.

So that's interesting. But then also we've got a chat with, Robert Abella, who we mentioned earlier from me press, and Tim Nash, who I like to call Sir Tim Nash. a conversation with Robert Abella and Tim Nash, WP Security, AI and the human factor. So doors open six o'clock in the usual venue if you're in London and you fancy a free event, pizza, beer, all of that kind of stuff.

And obviously conversation from the likes of Cameron. Join us, W-P-L-D-N. UK and that, I think we'll end it there on that bombshell. Thank you Cameron for prodding me about that. That got lost somehow. That's great. A few comments just before we end. What have we got? Oh, I'd like why all the comments at the end.

We've got no time to do them all. That's, oh. convert farenheit. It's,

[01:28:53] Michelle Frechette: go to the very last one.

[01:28:54] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, let's do, I'll go for this one. Convert Fahrenheit to Celsius in your head. Tra sec 13. Divide by two. That can't be right if that's true. That, I mean it must approximate, but there's no way that is exactly Right. Surely

[01:29:08] Mike Johnston: not. It's pretty, it's pretty close.

[01:29:11] Nathan Wrigley: Oh,

[01:29:11] Mike Johnston: okay. We did a, blog, my wife did a blog post while we were in Portugal. That was the inverse to convert interesting Celsius. double

[01:29:20] Nathan Wrigley: and then add 30

[01:29:21] Mike Johnston: double and add 30. and it's, approximate. The higher you go, it gets Yeah. It, you, lose a bit.

But in the middle it's, it works close enough for those of us who are Celsius challenged.

[01:29:36] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Okay. Celsius challenged. I love that. I love that. That's now my, that's how I'm gonna describe these things. let's have a little bit of a look. There's an important need for Mark. Okay. So very quickly, there's an important need for markdown right now.

I could be wrong, but there is an advantage with ai. Oh, okay. Okay. 'cause it's a flat file structure. Yeah, I imagine that's true. and then various other things as well. Interesting topic. A CF to block editor come along Maya. If you're in London, that is, if you are not then sorry, we can't.

[01:30:09] Michelle Frechette: But the one right before that says it's, he could be wrong, but it's been a while since we covered all of the stories.

[01:30:14] Nathan Wrigley: We never cover all the things never cover. Yeah, you're right. It's been like eight years since I've managed to cover all. That's good though, right? It means we've got more stuff to talk about than we have The other way around. I guess that's good. Yeah. Okay. So we will knock it on the head there, as we say in the uk.

Thank you very much for joining us. Appreciate the, the contributions from co-host Michelle. Thank you very much. Michelle. Mike Johnson who I will see in, I don't know, maybe a week's time, something like that. that'll be nice to hang out as well. And, Courtney as well, joining us today. And thank you very much for stepping in at the 11th hour.

That's very much appreciated. Absolutely. There only, there's only one thing we have to do now, which is the humiliating hand wave thing. So if we could all just do Oh look. All like pros. Straight away. Woo-hoo. And, we will be back. Will we be back next week? We won't be back next week. I'm gonna be on an aeroplane that there's a challenge and one that I'm not willing to take on.

but we'll be back a week having a week off basically. 'cause I'm gonna go to crack out on nerd out with WordPresses. But we'll see you in a couple of weeks time. Thanks for watching. Take care. Bye-bye for now.

[01:31:24] Mike Johnston: Bye buddy.

[01:31:25] Nathan Wrigley: Cheerio. Thanks so much. Bye-bye. Bye-bye.