This Week in WordPress #226

[00:00:00] Nathan Wrigley: It's time for this week in WordPress. Episode number 226 entitled So many Planes. It was recorded on Monday, the 17th of October, 2022. My name's Nathan Wrigley, and today I'm joined by three guests. I'm joined by Ken Elliot. I'm also joined by Davinder Singh Kainth and Michelle ButlerJones. We are here, as you might expect to talk about WordPress.

There's a few bits and pieces going on this week that we mentioned. The first thing is to say that WordPress release candidate number one for WordPress 6.1, has been released, and you can go and update and have a look at the changes. Gutenberg 14.3. Is updated and has got some nice new features with dragging and dropping images.

Davinder on the show today talks about the WP Awards for 2022 and how you can vote and what you might vote for. We spent quite a bit of time doing some voting. Blue Host and GoDaddy have got their managed Woo Commerce versions and they're being joined by wordpress.com in 2023. What's that all about? We also get into the topic of Black Friday deals I show off our Black Friday page.

I also mentioned the fact that in the coming week, Tuesday next week, I've got a UIUX show with Peach and Mary and how you can get involved in that. There's a lifetime deal for Ninja Tables, which is out, and also we talk about internet security and passwords. It's all coming up next on this week in WordPress.

This episode of the WP Builds podcast is brought to you by GoDaddy Pro. The home of managed WordPress hosting that includes free domain SSL and 24 7 support. Bundle that with The Hub by GoDaddy Pro to unlock more free benefits to manage multiple sites in one place. Invoice clients and get 30% of new purchases. Find out more at go.me/wpbuilds.

Hello? Hello. Good afternoon, good evening, Good morning. Depending on where you're joining us from. Very nice to have you with us. This is episode number 226. It's ridiculous of the WP Builds. This week in WordPress show, we're here to talk about a load of word pressy stuff that's happened in the last seven days.

And it would be dreadfully doll if it was me doing that all by myself. As always, I'm joined by some fabulous WordPress guests. You can see on the screen, I'm gonna get it right? Yes. First off, we've got Ken Elliot. How you doing, Ken? Good. Good. How are you doing? Yeah. Really good. Thank you.

Ken's Ken's joining us today from the United States, so he's one of the early rises. I appreciate it. And Ken is a recovering code addict and co-owner of B Creative, that's BK Creative Media Solutions. You can see it on his little Monica there which is, and he's based out of Columbia, South Carolina.

He's the, also the co-organizer of the Columbus WordPress meet group. And his goal is to help small and medium size businesses to grow their audience by providing online visibility services. It's been a while since we've had you on. It's a pleasure to have you back, Ken.

[00:03:25] Ken Elliott: Yeah, it's good to be back. I appreciate it so much.

Thank you.

[00:03:28] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, you're welcome. Ken's audio seems to be dropping in and out, but fear not. We're just gonna persevere. It's gonna be alright. It's a bit so cliquey, but never mind. We're also joined by Michelle Butcher Jones. Hello Michelle. Hello. How are you doing? I'm

[00:03:46] Michele Butcher-Jones: a bit chilly. It is like 41 Fahrenheit, which makes it like, what, like three in Celsius for the rest of the world this morning.

[00:03:55] Nathan Wrigley: Whoa. Whoa. That's colder than where I live. What? What is that? Is that not normal, I'm guessing?

[00:04:02] Michele Butcher-Jones: No, it's fairly normal. We go anywhere from like zero, a negative 10 to a hundred Fahn. Where I live, I get all the

[00:04:11] Ken Elliott: weather .

[00:04:12] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, it is that time of the year. Let me introduce Michelle properly. Michelle Butcher Jones is a nationally known and sought after WordPress speaker, trainer, and security specialist.

She's also the CEO of 13 Core. She's been involved in the WordPress community, helping people learn how to use their self-hosted WordPress sites, keep it secure and enjoys the process of building a great website for all the people. Thank you for joining us today, Michelle. Just out of interest, Michelle, because I have forgotten and I apologize for that.

Where exactly are you at? Three Degrees Center grade? I am

[00:04:45] Michele Butcher-Jones: in Carbondale, Illinois, which is about 50 miles north of the southern most tip of Illinois. Yeah, so opposite end

[00:04:54] Nathan Wrigley: of. Okay. Yeah. So I can understand why it's cold in that case. Yeah. Thank you. And I bet where Davin , I'm gonna guess Davinder, that it's not that cold where you are

[00:05:06] Davinder Singh Kainth: It's, it has started getting cold now, at least during nights. Like the, Yeah. Defined cold, for us, 20 degrees sentences is also really

[00:05:15] Nathan Wrigley: many . Yeah. It's getting no sympathy from us. . We, that's a good summer day for

[00:05:23] Ken Elliott: us. Our

[00:05:23] Davinder Singh Kainth: last hot is 40 degrees cel here,

[00:05:25] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, you can keep that. But I'll happily have the 20 degree cent just like fluid topography.

So Yeah. Where exactly are you?

[00:05:34] Davinder Singh Kainth: I'm in North India. I'm in a place called Maha Al, which is like six hours drive from Italy. So we are in the foothills of Himalaya. So it's a plain area, No mountains, but you can see the mountains from here. And yeah, so we get our range is we can drop to one degree cel in, winters.

Yeah,

[00:05:55] Nathan Wrigley: I know this feeling. I've experienced this. Anyway, proper introduction. It's a short one, but Davinder sinking is the WordPress sorry, is in the WordPress space, building client websites, coaching, creating digital products and content spaces like the WP weekly.com newsletter. I'm gonna say that one more time.

The WP weekly.com WordPress newsletter. Go and check it out. And also something which we're gonna mention a little bit later, probably in about 20 minutes or so, Davinder's got a fabulous award going on which we'll mention in just a moment. We're here to talk about WordPress, so let's get stuck into that.

A few self promotional bits. Oh no. First of all, let's see if anybody's made any comments because we love having people make comments. If you wish to make a comment, please feel very free to do that. There are a couple of caveats around that. The easiest place to go to make comments is to WP Builds.com/live, but that is a YouTube stream and it's got YouTube comments.

So that means you'll have to have some kind of Google account in order to be recognized there. Another option is to go into our Facebook group, and that's WP Builds.com/facebook. But there's a caveat to there, and that is that Facebook won't share your avatar or name with us unless you go to the following chat dot restream dot.

Slash fb. And if you do that, then we will see who you are. Some people get around that by just remaining anonymous, but just typing their name as the first thing each time they comment. Otherwise, you literally come through as Facebook user with a blank icon, and so we don't really know who you are. Also if you fancy sharing it, please do that.

WP Builds.com/live again, and Okay, let's see who's here. We've got Maya. Hello Maya. She says, Oh, there we go. Carrying on the conversation that us British people love. So very much the weather every, Hello everyone from sunny and cold Belgrade. Yeah, I feel smug this week. It's not that cold in the uk.

This. Never happens. So I'm gonna take every single thing I can get. The weather seems to be the theme because we're learning from Courtney Robertson that it's a foggy Monday in Gettysburg, Pennsylvania. Hi Courtney. Thanks for joining us. Thank you so much. This is an example of it. Look, so this Facebook user, we don't know who you are, but it says, Yay, go Delvin.

So I think that's Peter Red.

[00:08:23] Davinder Singh Kainth: I

[00:08:23] Nathan Wrigley: just, Sorry. Thank you Pete. Thank you Pete. Appreciate your participation. But if you wanna do that thing, you can click the link in the thing at the top and it'll show you what to do. And again, it's all the weather. Check it out. Good morning. From Cool and cloudy, Connecticut.

Oh, very accurate, Peter. With all the data, 46.9 degrees Fahrenheit, or 8.2 degrees cent. That's fabulous. This should be the. Every single week. And then we've also got Raoul who's coming to us from cold cutter India. Thank you very much, guys, ladies, gentlemen, whoever you might be. Appreciate it. Okey dokey.

Let's get stuck into what we're doing today. I apologize for the self promotional bit at the beginning, but there's a couple of things that I want to mention before we get stuck in properly. If you would like to follow what we do, this is our website, WP Builds.com. We are proudly sponsored by GoDaddy, as you can see on the bottom of that page.

Thank you GoDaddy, for helping us keep the WP Builds podcast going. You'll also notice at the top we have a banner for the WP Builds.com, Black forward slash black. It's our Black Friday page where we're gonna put a load of Black Friday links over the days and weeks to come. Guys, I want your honest opinion, right?

So this is to Ken, This is to Davinder and also Michelle, Is that button just stupid? What do you think? That's my Black Friday button and it's completely black.

[00:09:46] Michele Butcher-Jones: The button itself? No, but I would make it for the letter a bit more white so it can pop to read it to my, Yeah, I was being older that I'm, I'm 29 plus change.

[00:09:59] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, I was just thinking, I don't know, I just thought it might capture people's attention, but then of course I'm just being a bit of an idiot. I just thought it was clever. What do you reckon of Inda? Should I make it actually white text on a black background? That's not good for accessibility.

Oh, I know. Its not good. Just thought it was a good gimmick.

[00:10:18] Davinder Singh Kainth: Swords will come out really fast so

you can change it to say I'm c ccc, three Cs color. That would also look gray and still visible and will make a

[00:10:34] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, I think I'll do something like that, but I'm, I'm not gonna do it right now. . I'll do that later, but, Okay. Okay, so the jury's in. Ken, what do you think?

[00:10:44] Ken Elliott: I 100% hopeless. Clicking is still going on, but I 100% agree at least, worst case scenario, you could make the background yellow and yeah,

[00:10:52] Nathan Wrigley: text white, but, okay.

All right. Okay. I'm gonna change it. I'm gonna change it. I'll do it soon as this show's finished. Anyway, if you click that button, you get to this page, which is our WP Builds. Black Friday deals page. We've got we've got a few, It's, they start to dribble in about now, but you can see there's quite a few different deals already listed up there.

And it's searchable, filterable if you just click this button, you can filter by a different type and price and by name. So for example, I dunno, social, it gives you a list of, and you can filter down to the one that you want and so on and so forth. And then also, if you're interested in sponsoring this page, we get quite a lot of hits every year.

We've got a couple of sponsors so far, GoDaddy and WS Forms have sponsored it, but if you're fancy doing that, click this, Find out more bomb here. This one right here underneath the yellow circle. And we'll get you on the page. That'll. Another quick self promotional thing is I've got a show with Peach and e this coming, no, not to this coming a week tomorrow.

So a week on Tuesday and it's our monthly r ux show. If you want to get your site looked at by peacher as court needed last month, then common fill out this form. The URL is WP Builds.com/ui. Fill out the form and you never know, we might get you on the site, but we're also looking for deceptive designs as well.

That is to save dark patterns as they used to be called. We're looking to call out stupid examples on the internet where people deliberately try and confuse you. Like this stupid black button at the top here yet . Okay, promotion stuff all over. Let's get on with the WordPress stuff for this week. I dunno if anybody's got anything to add to this, but I'm just gonna broadly say what's going on.

WordPress 6.1 has reached a release candidate, stage. Release candidate. Is that period just. Before it's ready. In other words, we think it's ready, but it now needs pounding by people like you, dear listener to go and find things that are wrong with it. It's supposed to be coming out in just probably about two and a half weeks time now, and the features have all been frozen.

There's nothing gonna be added. This is just at the point now where we need people to go and pound on it and just see that everything's working. Okay. This is an article on WP Tavern. It was on the 12th of October, and Sarah Gooding mentions all of the different Jews that have made it into that release candidate.

There's quite a few of them. They're on the screen, but I won't list them all out. I don't know if DDA can or Michelle probably have nothing to say about that, but if you do, go for it now.

[00:13:22] Davinder Singh Kainth: I think there's a lot of a lot of features that are coming in this release. I think fluid font sizes is a good start to, fix the, make it easy with responsive.

And plus there's also improvement, how CSS is generated for blocks and. I think now there's also, you will block teams will require less CSS as more elements like buttons, headings, they're getting into Jason and Team Jason support. So there's a lot of, there's also performance improvement, which everyone will be happy.

There will be catching of database queries via with the WP Dash underscore query class. So that will make even hosting companies happy because less database power you will be required. Yeah. And the other feature that caught my attention, but it's, I think it didn't make it to 6.5, 6.1, is the content only adapting and locking feature.

So I'm not sure if it's coming, but maybe they've held it back

[00:14:21] Nathan Wrigley: so that, Yeah, I can't remember where we got to with that, to be honest. But this is where let's say a theme developer can enable different locking mechanisms within the block editor. Is that, are we talking about the same thing?

Exactly? Yeah. Yep. Yeah, and that'll be nice cuz at the moment, basically anybody with access to a post or a page can, although there is a locking feature, it doesn't really lock anything. It just it locks it to the point where anybody can unlock it and then just start editing. But, so it's a kind of visual lock, but not much more than that.

Yeah, that'll be a nice thing. And then the idea of being able to lock parent items and child items and so on, and assigned by user role and things like that would be great. Yeah. Yeah. Ken, Michelle, anything on that? Or should we move? It's a good look at the guy,

[00:15:07] Michele Butcher-Jones: more excited about the more block changes there are, the more it's growing, the more easier it's gonna be.

And hopefully eventually the more people will like it. ,

[00:15:16] Nathan Wrigley: that tells me, Michelle, that you are either you are all in on blocks or you're at least very bullish about them. Have you got that, is that your modus operandi now? Are you building sites with blocks or are you still using a, I don't know, the traditional themeing approach or perhaps a workpage builder or something like

[00:15:32] Michele Butcher-Jones: that?

I'm still doing the traditional theme approach at the moment. I'm actually still on I love my Genesis sites or using Cadence or Astra for building, but I'm just, the more it grows, the more fun it is, the more easier it is to use. And I feel like once we have everything kinda more figured out on getting the kinks out, it's going to be.

Hopefully in a way, like with GOs, where it's just gonna make it easier for everyone to use. Who wants to use it in that capacity?

Ken.

[00:16:09] Ken Elliott: Look guy's heavy. There's a lot of information in there. Like I said, I looked at a lot of stuff for the core and then it seems it's a big push for core in editors, so I'm interested to see a lot of those things there.

But overall, just, I think they said what, 500 updates

[00:16:30] Nathan Wrigley: and fixes? Yeah, something like that. Yeah. I've forgotten the number. Yeah. Yeah it was

[00:16:34] Ken Elliott: pretty heavy. I was impressed. And we'll see. I don't use a lot of the defaults because I use advanced custom fields pretty heavy for our client websites, But I'd be interested to see just performance wise how it.

[00:16:49] Nathan Wrigley: Thank you very much. Okay, that's great. So yeah, the atten the intention of these articles really is to just get people to pound on it. It's ready to be played with. Like I said, the features are all frozen, I think. So go and have a play. Don't do it on a production website. Please make sure that you've got some sort of local website or at least some sort of staging website.

Go and play with it there, and then in a few weeks time, we'll have a shiny new version of WordPress. So that'll be really nice. Okay, let's move on to the next piece then. Actually, let's pull this one up. The order, because we'll separate if you have an articles out. This do is now a bit of a thing, isn't it?

Is this the, this, the third time you've run this or the second time, or maybe the fourth, I can't remember. This is the WP Awards 2022. How long has it been going?

Davinder, I think you've muted yourself. I think it's

[00:17:48] Davinder Singh Kainth: the second year now. So this time the response has been, I think five x more than the last year because Oh, nice. Last year was the first one, so not many people knew it. And they were like, Okay, let's see what this is all about now. All those people who participated last year brought in more people.

So yeah, it's been, I'm, I had a busy last week, communicating with a lot of people, somewhere a little angry why my product went in this category and not that

[00:18:18] Nathan Wrigley: oh, really? Oh. Or presumably a few people saying, Why isn't my product in any category? That kind of

thing.

[00:18:25] Davinder Singh Kainth: Exactly. I, you gotta have a certain strict rules.

My rule was like, if you don't submit it during nomination phase, it doesn't get into the voting thing because I, there's so many products, I cannot manually put all the

[00:18:37] Nathan Wrigley: products there. Yeah. Okay. So that's an interesting thing. So it's got a, it's got a series of phases. The idea is just like any award, the Oscars or whatever it might be.

It's just to raise a bit of awareness about about various different things within the WordPress community. So it's you had a call for sponsors, which obviously you're satisfied, we can see your sponsors listed across there. And then you had several weeks where, oh no, six or seven weeks where you called for nominations to go into

[00:19:06] Davinder Singh Kainth: sessions.

Yeah, I increased it LA in the first one. I only had three or four weeks, and a lot of people emailed me after that, Hey, I didn't know I missed it. So I actually intentionally increased the, spacing of weeks for every phase this time around.

[00:19:20] Nathan Wrigley: And then voting began. I'm not sure when, but it presumably it began shortly after the, the September the 15th.

So you can now go and vote Last week. Yeah. When, Sorry, last week, last Monday. So it's it's open for voting and it will be until the very end of November 30th and November. And all you gotta do is submit your name, your email address, and then it's broadly just, I'll just go through a selection of them.

How many categories are there? There's about there's not about, there's 23 different categories, and it ranges from things like themes, page builders forms, dynamic data, Gutenberg, addons element, or seo. I'm just doing them at random members and courses. eCommerce tools content tools, WordPress, blogs, podcasts, Podcast, Section 19.

Podcast. I'm not gonna say that again. Podcast 19. Oh, no. One of

There's a podcast there. And the idea is that you just go through, vote for your different ones. You can completely leave sections of blank if you like. So in theory you could just vote. For one section, and then what do you do with it all the vendor, when all that data's been amassed and the final date has been eclipsed.

You looks like you're announcing things, but what does that mean? What do you do with the announcement?

[00:20:34] Davinder Singh Kainth: Besides, voting and all that, the feedback that I've got last year, it was like, Hey, I didn't know this product was popular or was existed, has existed in this category. So thanks for actually doing it.

Like people are discovering new products just by looking at the voting form. So once the voting is over, I just download the data, run a function in Google, sheet and find top three in every category. So there's top three in every category and there's top five overall who gets the maximum awards.

So

[00:21:06] Nathan Wrigley: yeah. Yes. I seem to remember the admin bar last year was the sort of like the overall winner. It. Like the full Monty, was that right? I'm sure. Sure it was. Yeah. Yeah. And then there were various other bits and pieces. So basically we're encouraging you to go and vote. It's the, Oh, I thought the URL was gonna be the WP Awards, but it's not.

It's over at your website. The wp weekly.com. That is also the url. It gets redirected Oh, so if we go to the WP awards.com, would we get redirected to here? Yes. Okay. Okay. Okay. In that case, let's go through a few and we're gonna, we're gonna, in a nonpartisan way, say what our favorites are politically.

If you can't say what your favorite is, that's fine, we'll just brush it aside and move on. Davinder you have to say anything at this point. ?

[00:22:01] Davinder Singh Kainth: No, I can clearly tell my favorite. It's no big deal. It's just like my favorites are just the tools that I'm using currently. Which may change down the line, but

[00:22:09] Nathan Wrigley: again, Okay.

Okay. Davinder, let's go through. So Ken, Michelle Davinder, let's go for a few of these categories. What's your favorite theme currently? What would you be putting for in here?

[00:22:19] Davinder Singh Kainth: Mine would be Astra, because that's what I use

[00:22:21] Nathan Wrigley: Okay, fair enough. Ken, is yours featured here or not? Hello, Theme. Hello. So that's the, Hello.

This one, This would be you. That's the elemental theme, isn't it? Of course. Yep. They're like super lightweight, elemental theme. So we've got one vote for Elementor. The hello theme. We've got one vote. What did you say? Davinder Astra. Astra, Yeah. Okay. And Michelle, would it be any of these or No, I'm gonna go with Cadence.

Oh, So cadence theme. And the one that I've used most recently would be, I'm just gonna do it by that. I played with it the other day and really enjoyed it would be Blocksi. So I.

[00:22:59] Davinder Singh Kainth: And one notable omission in this category last year, Genesis was there, but no one submitted. Genesis. This same,

[00:23:06] Nathan Wrigley: Oh, Michelle, you missed it.

Better luck next time. Okay. All right. Alright. All right, let's keep going. This is fun. Page builders. Let's start with Michelle. Page builder up here. Maybe it's a no. Maybe it's a Yes,

[00:23:22] Michele Butcher-Jones: I am. I'm getting to be really just in love with Guttenberg. But if you're going to actually pick a standalone page.

Builder. Plugin, it's still Beaver Builder.

[00:23:31] Nathan Wrigley: Beaver Builder gets Michelle's vote. What about you can, why

[00:23:36] Ken Elliott: now let's stay put. Elementor is really sad

[00:23:41] Nathan Wrigley: to just drag and. Yep. Elementor. So that's okay. And Davin, I'm gonna guess yours. I'm gonna guess this one. I'm gonna, I think you are gonna say be for Builder.

Absolutely.

[00:23:52] Davinder Singh Kainth: All my clients just stick with one tool and just

[00:23:56] Nathan Wrigley: be inspired. Yeah. Okay. I'm gonna, I'm gonna be the thorn in everybody's side. I'm gonna say, I'm gonna say Guttenberg, If not Guttenberg, I would've said Beaver Builder. It definitely a toss up between those two. But more recently I have been using Guttenberg to do everything just cause I wanna see how all of that works.

Okie Doki. Should we go with forms? Let's do a couple more. I'm enjoying this. The vendor, you first, What can I guess this as well? I'm gonna guess this one. I think you're gonna say fluent forms. Yeah. Because this

[00:24:25] Davinder Singh Kainth: form is made with fluent forms, .

[00:24:27] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, I had a look. This is definitely made fluent, but I'm also a Gravity

[00:24:32] Davinder Singh Kainth: Forms user because traditionally that was the first actual, complex or modern form that I've used and it's still active on a lot of client sites.

But yeah, in recent times, a lot of other sites have

[00:24:43] Nathan Wrigley: fluent forms as well. Do you know, it's interesting in here, just before I get to Michelle and Ken, there's a couple on here that I genuinely haven't even heard of. Like I've never heard of Jet Form Builder or Met Form. So you're right. It promotes me to go and look at new tools that I'd never heard of before.

Okay. Ken? Favorite Form Builder then. Yeah, Gravity

[00:25:02] Ken Elliott: Forms is right where I'd be at.

[00:25:05] Nathan Wrigley: Fair Play. Gravity forms solid, isn't it? Absolutely. Rock solid. It's like the default, isn't it? If somebody talks about forms in WordPress, that seems to be the one. Gets the mention more to

[00:25:16] Davinder Singh Kainth: and the new user interface is really needed, almost like a block editor.

So

[00:25:20] Nathan Wrigley: yeah, it looks, it's mimic the block editor very closely, doesn't, it? Really does look like it, although I'm told it's not. It's just A skin. It looks like it. Yeah. And what about you, Michelle? Which would you go for?

[00:25:33] Michele Butcher-Jones: I've tried a few of these on here and I always keep going back to gravity forms.

[00:25:39] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. Gravity forms the clear winner here I'm using fluent forms. I think Davinder, you and I probably got a, I'm gonna say three, four years ago or something, there was a lifetime deal on fluent forms and it was a really great deal. It was like $150 for lifetime use or something. And I don't have very comprehensive form needs, And the fact that Davinder can build something like this illustrates that it can do that.

So that's where I ended up with. Okay. Let's do a couple. I really am enjoying this. This is ridiculous. I really love it. It okay. Dynamic data plugins. I'm gonna, I'm gonna pick Kens, just cause of what you said a minute ago. You're gonna say ACF Pro?

[00:26:18] Ken Elliott: Definitely. Yep, Definitely. And it's much interesting now that it's been bought.

So the interface has changed a little bit. I think we're on 6 0 6 1, I can't remember. But yeah, the interface has changed a little bit, so getting

[00:26:31] Nathan Wrigley: used to that. Yeah. Yeah, it's got a lot nicer, hasn't it? I feel that they've got rid of a lot of vertical space in Yes. The latest acf, they've de clotted it.

And I, I use acf. For me, it would definitely be ACF as well. And I went in, as soon as I got that email and had a look, I was like, it's pretty subtle, but it actually meant that I could see a lot more on the screen Absolutely. Yeah. Nice point. Okay. Davinder forms, Sorry. Dynamic data. I

[00:26:58] Davinder Singh Kainth: always use bots, but I've used cpro on other sites, but then I also use BMO on every website,

[00:27:03] Nathan Wrigley: so it's, yeah, it's interesting that this ended up here.

Beaver Athema as a dynamic data blocking, but yeah, I, It should be

[00:27:09] Davinder Singh Kainth: in the dev tool category maybe because but then it's related because again, it handles the output, which pods can also handle the output. So I'll give a word pods here.

Yep. Okay. And Michelle?

[00:27:23] Michele Butcher-Jones: It's a Tulsa for me between a c F Pro and pods.

Interesting. It's me personally building it. I have better success for myself with pods. But a couple of my developers are much more with ACF

[00:27:44] Nathan Wrigley: Pro. Okay. Okay. Just got a couple of comments coming in. Pete Everett says that he really likes the new ACF layout, so yeah, totally agree. Rod Cairns is saying that he uses Ws for, this is great.

We're having these votes coming in live. This is brilliant. And Pete Everett is also saying another one for Beaver theme as well. Yeah. Interesting. Okay. Let's miss a few out. I'm or everybody's favorite talking point back up on migration. Okay. Where we, where are we at with this? I'm gonna stick my foot in the sand and say it used to be backup body, then it's either me, it's either gonna be blog vault.

Or up Draft Pro. I think it's one of those two. I've got like a 50 50 split, I think more or less with those two. So that's me. A blog Vault or Updraft. Ken, where you going with this? Got it. Hate two

[00:28:38] Ken Elliott: 51st. But I'm telling you what I've used all in one. I've used, I'm using WP Vivid right now. I've used Updraft.

Oh my goodness. If I had to make a decision, the only reason why I was a big fan of All in one was mostly because it was just bring it downloaded. Uploaded. Yep. Really quick. So that was one of the biggest reasons why I made all in one migration.

[00:29:05] Nathan Wrigley: Yep. Okay. We'll stick with that as if that's your vote.

Of course you can change your mind at any point. And.

[00:29:13] Michele Butcher-Jones: I've tried most of these and I did used to really be a backup buddy fan girl. Now it's mostly Updraft plus for backups, but Blog vault for migrations.

[00:29:28] Nathan Wrigley: Uhhuh. Interesting. Yeah. Blog Vault.

[00:29:33] Michele Butcher-Jones: Oh, sorry. Especially when Flywheel and WP Engine and a lot of their migration plugins are technically just blood

[00:29:41] Nathan Wrigley: vault plugins.

Yeah. And of course Blog Vault have got Migrate Guru as well, which kind of could have fitted into here, which it almost feels like a SAS service as well. It just does everything and it's super fast. Who haven't we said we've had Davinder. Where are you going with this

[00:29:58] Davinder Singh Kainth: backup buddy and all in One migration.

Other one I always use but I use all in one migration more these days, okay.

[00:30:05] Nathan Wrigley: All righty. Okay, let's let's just get, Okay, where are we going? Oh, podcasts. Oh okay. I'm not voting in this one. I neither anybody else, cuz that's just ridiculous. Let's stop there, shall we? We've probably done enough of that. Okay. I enjoyed that. That was quite a bit of fun. Cloud Way's. Migrator says Pete Everett. Cloud Ways Migrator plugin isn't on there, although it's based on blog vault.

Yeah. A lot of Pete, a lot of the hosts have skinned, I think Blog Vault have got like a, how to say it, like a white label kind of thing with a lot of the hosting companies. And so you do find that, So I don't know if it's that. Anyway, the point is, go to. The wp weekly.com/awards, or better yet, if you just go right to the top and just search for the WP Awards 2022.

It's the wp awards.com and you'll be able to do it and have a bit of fun like we just did, making some votes. That was good. Thank you guys. I appreciate that. Okay, next one. Gutenberg, 14.3 improves drag and drop. This is all about images. This piece, it's Sarah Gooding 14th of October, and essentially they're just tightening up.

If you don't use, if you use Gutenberg in WordPress, great. But there's also a Gutenberg plugin, which is like the bleeding edge of what's happening in WordPress, Gutenberg development. So if you wanna see what's coming, you can install the Gutenberg plugin and it'll enable you to see, it's like the beater version of things.

And there's it's pretty, it's pretty nuanced, but essentially you can now drag and drop images into a paragraph block. Prior to this, you had to specify an image block and then go and search your image and so on. Now, in this video, it's hard to see what's going on, but there's basically a paragraph block there and they drop an image in and it's, you're done.

So that's nice. There's also what else was there? Let me just have a little look. I can't remember what else there was, to be honest as well, but that was the sort of headline item. Can anybody else remember what was in this piece? I've forgotten now.

Let me have a look. Oh, there's a zoomed in. That was it. There's a zoomed in view. So there's this possibility to zoom in so that you can order your the blocks. And it says here, the site editor also has a drag and drop capabilities for blocks and patterns in the new zoomed out view. It's not called zoomed in view, it's called zoomed out view, although I see it as being zoomed in, which was added in Guttenberg 14.1.

It zooms out to focus on building and composing patterns, allowing users to move things around without affecting inner blocks. So in other words, you can just drag things including parent items and it takes children along for the ride. And if you watch this short video, it's not really illustrative of that, but you can just click on the inspector drag things.

And in it goes, and then you can move them up and down in the, in that easy to use way. So that's good. And there's also support here for alt plus keyboard combinations for navigating blocks. I confess I was never using keyboards to navigate the blocks, but apparently in the past it wasn't so easy to do.

But now, if you use the alt plus the op arrow, you'll get to the very top of the paragraph that you've currently been editing, which is nice if you're using lots of paragraphs. That's cool. You can get to the top without, without fiddling your mouth and guess with your mouse. And guess what?

If you use the alt down arrow, you'll get to the end of a text block, and that's basically it. Anybody got anything to add on that?

[00:33:48] Davinder Singh Kainth: Drag and drop was very bad when Gutenberg was introduced. Like you would drag something and you will just spray it landed at the right place. But now fortunately they've improved a lot with every new version.

And now I think drag andro is almost similar to a, baked page builder. Almost there, but still some refinement can be there.

[00:34:10] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, I agree. It's quirky, isn't it? Ken can probably nod to this if he's been using Elemental for ages and Beaver Builder the same. There's never been a time in those products development where you couldn't accurately put an image exactly where you wanted it.

From the, from like version one. You just drag on the image, stick it exactly where you want it, and there it is. There was just no failure rate, and quite, to my surprise at least anyway, when Gutenberg rolled out that was a hot mess. You tr, you've literally ended up at a completely random place.

Quite often I'd drag an image and it would go to the top of the post for no apparent reason, even though I was like 14 paragraphs in. But it's definitely heading for compar, I would say. Yeah. Ken, anything? Michelle?

[00:34:58] Michele Butcher-Jones: Nope. I, this was one of my pain points too.

[00:35:03] Nathan Wrigley: It's getting to the point where you could definitely hand this over to clients and they've got a little bit more of a fighting chance of of managing things.

Sorry, Ken, I think I might crosstalk to you.

[00:35:12] Ken Elliott: No, you're fine. I was gonna ask more of a question. How close is this to, and this is a question for everybody, how did close do you think this is to the end result? Like where you're looking at other platforms that are able to

[00:35:27] Nathan Wrigley: do drag and drop?

Can I might go first there. It's . Do you know what I want to say? It's really close. , it's not really close. Because the so in something like Elementor, you can really see it. It's literally identical, right? A apart from the fact that you've got the UI with the little borders going around it, and you've got the cogs and the little tool panels which appear when you are hovering over things.

Basically as soon as you press save, same in Beaver Builder, the, that UI goes away. But the page looks identical, doesn't it? It's just the same. You really don't quite get that experience because there are bits of the UI in Guttenberg, which get in the way. If you are adding a new block, for example, there's this big plus icon which stretches the width of the screen more or less, and so it sits there and you can't make it go away.

So there's all sorts of different things. The quirky thing is after using it for a period of time, You know that isn't gonna be there. So you just do these little mental jumps and you think, Okay, that won't be there. That won't be there. That would, and it'll and in the end, you can predict what it's gonna look like more or less perfectly, but it does take more effort.

I don't know if you guys agreed to, and Michelle, I think

[00:36:46] Davinder Singh Kainth: this reminds me when Good book came out, that reminded me of a, page builder plugin or build plugin called site origin that came before B builder or elementary and DV and all that things. But even comparing this with non-board per solution, I think we can better compare it with elementary and B builder in terms of, usability now.

As of now, WordPress, a block is pretty good. If you're only using it to write content like dragging paragraphs, headlines that's perfectly fine. But if you're trying to build a layout, your landing page homepage, then it's not a visual editor like Nathan, you pointed out, like you do something, but that doesn't look that way when you review the page, right?

So maybe that's not their intention. So comparing it with Square Space, Ws, and all those other, even web flow doesn't make much sense because first we need to compare with their own cousins and sisters within WordPress.

[00:37:44] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Yeah. I think you're right. The intention cannot be to have it exactly wizzy wig, otherwise they would've got rid of those UI components, which cause it to be so difficult.

So I would say, Ken it's definitely worth experimenting with. I think feature wise it's on. And the capability of blocks is gonna be extremely powerful. So you'll be able to drag in like whole mini, mini applications with a block which will be at some point easier to build cuz of things like the Creator tool, which has come out fairly recently.

So it enables you to build blocks in a, you don't have to go through the whole process of learning react and all that kind of stuff. But it's definitely not there. And, text is fine, images is fine, but if you're trying to do complicated layouts with, and it's one of a

[00:38:35] Davinder Singh Kainth: foundation, that's what press is providing us.

Because in the end, if you really want that college experience, there are a lot of block addons that have appeared. Just add one of those, you'll get closer to elementary kind of an experience.

[00:38:47] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, that's a good point. Something like cadence theme and blocks or generate blocks or all of the other different things.

It's worth playing with though, I would say, Ken, because it does. It does give you a sort of a, an interesting idea of where the project is heading. Anyway, sorry Michelle, I think you were maybe gonna speak Oh, on that one. No, I don't have anything. Okay. Okay. Sorry, Interrupted. Yeah, definitely worth a look, but not quite there yet.

Let's have a lot, another look Peter's just com made in a, making a comment. Another factor regarding the wizzywig is the theme being used. Yeah, that's a good point. Some are better than others on the editor side. And then Ken, I don't know if you've been following the story recently. We've also had this since probably about six months ago, we've had full site editing, which requires a full site editing theme, and they're a completely different beast altogether.

You start, I would say the friction of creating things like navigation is still really hard. I wouldn't be putting that in front of clients just yet, whereas the traditional WordPress appearance menu section is still superior, I would say for clients. But yeah. Yeah, it's definitely worth a look.

And then, you've got people like Michael Oliver who are using things like generate blocks who pretty much can get pixel perfect. You show him a site and he can build that in, generate blocks really quickly. And it's exactly the same as the original, but it's only using five blocks, which is pretty, pretty cool.

You don't need all the cruft as it were. Yeah. Anyway. Interesting. All right, let's move on. This one. WP Tavern again. Sarah Gooding. Okay, so I think this is gonna be our hot topic of the week word. WordPress has decided that they're gonna do a woo hosted WooCommerce solution to wordpress.com in 2023, following recent launches from GoDaddy and Blue Host.

If you've been listening to this show, you will know that over the last I can't point the dates out, maybe Courtney and the comments can help me out here. Certainly from the GoDaddy side GoDaddy and the blue host of both put out their own WooCommerce Solutions. Goads. One of the main pitches for the GoDaddy offering is that you get all the WooCommerce stuff, but then you also get a slightly cheaper payment gateway as opposed to the Stripe transaction fees, which I think is 2.9%.

I think the go. Payments option is 2.4%. So that's one of the one of their sort of unique selling points. Blue Host recently acquired y and so one of their selling points is that you get all of the y plugins along for the ride. And I suppose this begs the question, I wonder why wordpress.com hasn't got into this one Now They are going to be getting into it in the very near future.

From the goad, sorry, from the wordpress.com team. Somebody called Mariana, I think said that it's gonna have the following options. It's gonna be WooCommerce pre-installed, activated and hosted a pre-packaged set of essential plug-ins. Dunno what they'll be, but e. Dunno what that means. Simplified onboarding with partner systems to improve conversion, competitive monthly pricing to reduce churn and co-marketing and revenue share with hosts.

So that to me, felt like the whole thing was in competition. And then I read this comment right at the bottom here. You can see Matt Mullen, the co-founder of WordPress, says he just wants to make it clear that the woos hosting in air quotes package will be open to any host who wants to partner with them and offer it, including Goddaddy Blue Host and Liquid Web.

And for me at least, that muddied the waters cuz didn't really understand what that meant. So in other words, are they putting this solution together? Which companies, hosting companies can come and say, we would like to, to bond that in our hosting. Do they pay wordpress.com? Is there a, how does it work? I don't know, but obviously this the WooCom space is heating up with lots and lots of people.

Now getting into it as a one click sort of solution by the hosting and get commerce along for the right's. Fascinating. It's really hotting up, so I'll open it up to you three if you want to comment on that. Yeah

[00:43:02] Davinder Singh Kainth: it's an interesting times because with commerce, the thing is commerce easy is installed, but when the store starts running, it becomes difficult.

And it's mostly the hosting part that drags the whole, experience down. And now it's all about consolidation and it's not just hosting companies can charge premium for commerce specific things, and plus they can also make money via your, their own payment, which is a recurring income for, which is like what PayPal and Stripe makes their living off.

Right? And when you offer the package thing, I think what commerce package can be, the commerce software add-ons, and the payment gateway. Now, if Automatic offers all three of them as a package to other hosts, Which may not include GoDaddy because GoDaddy has their own payment, system and. May prefer to use their own, just like automatic and commerce will prefer to use their own.

, it's mostly targeted at hosts that may not have their own au payment system or own plugins because now I think every big hosting company has their own plugin, suit like Goad has Skywork Blue Host has with, and even this is, we are talking now that because Blue Host and GoDaddy launched it with a lot of fanfare, but I think it has existed before.

Also, like Nexus and Liquid Web were offering, commerce hosting for quite some time, like almost an year now. But it's just now they're making more noise and they, the noise get, gets amplified when automatic also follows the same thing.

[00:44:34] Nathan Wrigley: Just before Ken and Michelle crack into this, we'll just say a couple of comments come in.

The first one's. Phil Levine. Hello, Phil. Nice to have you with us. Says this is just gonna generate more support stroke confusion for people who think they can diy, but really need help. Okay, that's an interesting comment. Thank you. And Courtney, thank you for replying. Courtney GoDaddy's plan includes the payment gate where Woo.

Extensions. Thank you. Oh yeah, and of course there was a Pagely acquisition a little while ago, which was a, real top tier managed WordPress hosting company. So you get all of that goodness as well. Omnichannel selling, shared inventory marketplaces. Oh yeah, there's the whole sync isn't there, so it syncs your product.

So the goad offering specifically will sync your product, inventory and catalog with a bunch of third party marketplaces. If I think it was at the bottom of this article actually. Let me see if I can find that. Yeah, here we go. Etsy, Amazon, eBay, and various others as well. So if you're selling on those platforms, you just need the one.

Go do thing. Okay. So thank you Courtney for clarifying that and I'll take that away and pass it over to Michelle or Kim.

[00:45:47] Michele Butcher-Jones: My first thought was everybody wants to be an existential threat these days. .

[00:45:53] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, it's interesting. Yeah. Yeah. There's lots of lots of people basically doing the same thing. And yeah, it's gonna be interesting how this pans out, Ken.

[00:46:04] Ken Elliott: That's pretty much my approach is just how's it gonna pan out? I'm very interested. I was, it was almost like a slam dunk, obvious choice to get into the WooCommerce space and get into the online shopping space. Mostly because as people continue to grow forward and the online marketing just continues, the online marketplaces, the stores and stuff continue to grow and everybody becomes their own entrepreneur to, in a sense, Everybody's gonna need assistance.

And so how do you get into that piece of the pie? How do we get people, give them the opportunity to create something without having to reach out to a developer or reach out to anybody to just do it. Hey, let me let GoDaddy, or let me let Blue Host, or in this instance WordPress Automatic. Do it. Just press a button.

Hey, here you go. And hey, guess what? Here's some plugins and here's a payment gateway and here's some people who can assist you with this. That way you're not trying to figure out, are trying to find somebody to help assist your WooCommerce site.

[00:47:14] Nathan Wrigley: If you were a, if you were, if your specialty was w Commerce installations, if you had a niche agency, which was.

Woo commerce related. You're into WordPress, but you're specifically nicheing down on Woo Commerce. I wonder if this is a time where you are starting to be a little bit nervous about the days, weeks, months, and years to come, or if this is just growing the marketplace and growing the relevance and growing the recognition of it.

You were shaking your head there, Ken, so obviously you think the answer's no. I'll

[00:47:46] Ken Elliott: give you a perfect example. Remember there was a lot of developers that were threatened when WordPress first came out. They were like, Oh my goodness, they're taking my job. So guess what is now another opportunity for you to promote your business and say, Hey, I can assist with this.

There might be some things that I can't do. That goad or WordPress can assist with. But guess what? If you don't want to have to worry about those things, I'll take care of it for you. And I'm still the point person, the one on one contact that you know and and can assist you directly with your.

Which are functionality.

[00:48:24] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Yeah. Good point. Okay. So anyway we've, we're looking for this to drop in February next year. We'll see how the, the advertising and all of that sort of ramps up in the days, weeks and Monster come, but another option. February, 2023, the article there was entitled Hosted WooCommerce Solutions coming to wordpress.com in 2023 plus some more.

And it was 12th of October, Sarah Gooding. Okay. Let's mention a deal quickly. We occasionally mentioned these from time to time when they come around this, we were mentioned in fluent forms earlier who had a lifetime deal. They've they've put another one of their products, I think it's their first product.

Their company is called WP Manage and Ninja. And Joel, who is the, I'm gonna say ceo, that could be wrong, but I suspect he is. He reached out to me and he said, Could you just mention this? And I said, Yeah, sure. Looks good. And it's their oldest plugin. It's called Ninja Tables, and essentially it's much more complicated than I thought.

Davinder gave me some examples earlier about the kind of things that it can do, but the bottom line is it's a tables plug in for WordPress, but it seems like you can throw it with, throw it together with things like ACF and so data out of custom post types displaying tables and Davinder, you were mentioning that it's pretty cool with things like Google Sheets as well.

Yeah, you

[00:49:46] Davinder Singh Kainth: can output any kind of database. Just drop in a Google Sheet's URL and it'll output, or you can just display certain types of posts with categories or custom post type posts. Or you can even display the results or the submissions of your contract form. So there's so many things it can do. It's not as simple and it has all kinds of filters and such options that you can add.

It's also good for showing commerce's

[00:50:09] Nathan Wrigley: products. Yeah, look at that. So it's it's got all the faceted search. So like an old

[00:50:16] Davinder Singh Kainth: school table plugin plus air table kind of functionality. Huh.

[00:50:20] Nathan Wrigley: That's pretty incredible. A

[00:50:21] Michele Butcher-Jones: question. How is it for responsiveness? Because I know a lot of table plugins really lacking

[00:50:27] Davinder Singh Kainth: that.

It's pretty good. It's pretty good.

[00:50:30] Nathan Wrigley: You should try, I think they're gonna go to their demo site and we'll have a little look, shall we? So here's a, So we've got a side. So I can't do much about the sidebar, but let's just shrink this down. It's gonna mess up our screen to be honest, but it doesn't matter.

Let's have a look. There you go. That's what you get. Oh, nice. So let's have a look at the different break points you get. Okay. So you get a, Oh no, it doesn't even scroll. It just truncates everything when you get that size and then you get this, so obviously lumps everything into one, one row at a time, which is what I'd expect, I would've thought.

Yeah, that looks pretty good. I'm happy with that. Yeah. Sorry, Go on. Carry.

[00:51:16] Davinder Singh Kainth: I'm the proud owner, so I bought it first time when they launched it. So I've used it on few websites, but then it's a very niche product and, but whenever the need arises it works. Plus user, so it matches with two forms pre for

[00:51:34] Nathan Wrigley: fine. Yeah. So if you, Sorry, I'm not using this as an example of doing this again, but, So this Black Friday page is essentially it's not a table, but it is a table.

It's got an image, it's got a title, it's got a description, it's got all these different fields and a button and you can search and filter things down here. Essentially it would work really well in this same format. Images, all of this kind of stuff. So that, yeah, there's a good example.

You got the images and buttons and all that kind of stuff. So I could take the data for this, which, whoops, for this, which is currently held as a custom post type in WordPress with ACF mapping the fields. And then we're using Facet WP to display all of this. I could map all of this to a Google sheet, which would be really easy for me to work with.

And then, Fluent form. Sorry. Fluent, what's it called? Fluent, Ah, it's called Ninja Tables. That's it. Ninja tables would periodically go and sync that sheet. Is that how it works? To know? So

[00:52:35] Davinder Singh Kainth: if you have a Google sheet and you've added that URL into Ninja Table, right? Yeah. And then you go back and update the Google sheet within few minutes.

The table also get it, get automatically updated. So now you know what you have to do after this call.

[00:52:50] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, Stop it. You've just taken my, taken the rest of my day away. Okay. So the, it looks great. I've gotta say it looks great. I've had no problems with their products. They've been absolutely brilliant so far.

It is a lifetime deal. That's why I'm mentioning it. That's, that was it. I'd forgotten why we were mentioning it. The lifetime deal. Let's have a look, see if we can scroll and find the pricing. There you go. So this is, one domain is $129. And it says here, lifetime updates. Lifetime supports, all features.

20 domains is 2 49. And then if you wanna go all in, all unlimited domains, it's 400, 3 90 $9. I like it. Look at that. Let's see. Did you see that? Just for a brief moment. Look, there's the vendor endorsing it. . That's great.

[00:53:42] Ken Elliott: I wasn't

[00:53:42] Nathan Wrigley: faking

[00:53:42] Davinder Singh Kainth: it, right? I'm not, It

[00:53:44] Nathan Wrigley: was so funny cause it's on a carousel. It's on a carousel and as soon as I'd sp it, it disappeared after Chris Hughes

That's, But you obviously do like it if you're if you're endorsing on the website. So this is ninja tables.com/discount deal. Are you, this kind of stuff intrigue you Ken or Michelle, this kind of plugin you'd find yourself digging into your pockets for? I'm intrigued.

[00:54:11] Michele Butcher-Jones: I'm definitely gonna be

[00:54:11] Nathan Wrigley: looking into it.

Yeah. Yeah. Ken intrigued.

[00:54:16] Ken Elliott: Let's take a look at

[00:54:16] Nathan Wrigley: it. Yeah, I think if this had been like four years ago, I always, I got more than intrigued by just about everything shiny like this I would end up sort of buying things and then having buyers remorse when I realized like a year later I hadn't done it.

I've definitely got a lot better at that. Now. I don't own this, but I'll definitely go back and have a solid look at it and here we go. The demo tab, I think is, is the thing that we wanna look at. Right here's something which was unexpectedly called this week. I , I have no words to describe what happened this week.

I was looking at a, and you won't be able to see the audio right, but I use main wp I don't know if any of you use this. Main, WP is a plugin. We've mentioned it loads on this show. It's a plugin which allows you to, you install it on a dedicated WordPress install. So you might call it something like, I dunno manage.my domain.com or update.my domain.com.

And then you link it with a child plugin on all of your client websites. So you install the child plugin and then it instantly starts to sync and therefore, You can go and update all of your client websites. I was doing a podcast episode with a friend of mine called David Walmsley. He, we do it every couple of weeks on this channel.

And we were saying, Do you know what would be really nice? It would be really nice if Main WP didn't just report the things that it did. So in other words, if you go and update a plugin from Main wp, it keeps track of that. Wouldn't it be nice if it kept track of things that your clients did without you?

They install and new plugin, they update a plugin manually. Wouldn't that be nice? Blow me. Dennis Doman, the plugin founder. He just go . He went and built the feature, went and built the feature, and then he made this little short YouTube video and it's included in there and it's, he called it something, I don't know, something like the WP Builds non WP changes.

So I just thought I'd give him a bit of a hat tip. I thought that was really cool. Not only did he listen to the podcast episode, but then he took note, went away and built the feature and added it into the plugin. So I thought that was pretty incredible.

[00:56:34] Ken Elliott: That's a good feature. That's a great idea and I'm glad to see it and I'm glad that you got name

[00:56:38] Nathan Wrigley: recognition for it too. Oh, I don't think he's, I don't think he's ultimately gonna call it that he's ultimately calling it here it is. Like he's ultimately calling it something like non main WP changes, but that's really cool, right?

That to me is like a nice audit trail. For things that your clients did that you didn't do, that they then pretend they didn't do you? You've been there before, right? I didn't do it. No, you did do it. No, I didn't. Oh, .

[00:57:04] Michele Butcher-Jones: And that would save you for putting on a second plugin, like stream or something like that for it?

[00:57:11] Nathan Wrigley: Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I dunno how in depth it's gonna be, but you can see on the video it just says the most recent non main WPL plugin and theme changes. So it looks like it's just plugin and theme changes. But obviously if they've updated something or added a new plugin and they didn't do it via main WP, then yeah, it could just be an indication that the client is, being a good custodian of their own website.

You might take it as a positive, but also it's gonna show you when they, I don't know, went in and did things that you knew were harmful. So I just thought that was a cool feature.

[00:57:42] Ken Elliott: You know what I would love for this as well is, and I, let's just add on if they changed their passwords because one of the biggest gripes is for me is password changes.

And they'll say, Okay, I didn't know that creating this using password 1, 2, 3 was going to get my website hacked. And if there was a way for me to get an idea that they changed their password to something that is below a certain strength level would be awesome. And I could say, Hey, I suggest.

Change your password

[00:58:14] Nathan Wrigley: to something else. Yeah, that is a nice idea. Let's hope Dennis is listening to this and in two or three weeks time he'll have the Ken Elliots password management extension for main wp. That would be cool.

[00:58:27] Davinder Singh Kainth: I think a lot of security plugins also show these because I use Pad Stack and it tracks everything that is done and, but the good thing is it doesn't store logs on your server.

It stores logs on their server or no pressure on your hosting. Yeah, so it stands everything like which plugin got updated, which user did it? So yeah.

[00:58:45] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. I guess Plug Stack. So Patch that used to be web, it's it primarily markets itself as a sort of security firewall. So it's basically

[00:58:59] Davinder Singh Kainth: a tax product, but that connects with your WordPress

[00:59:02] Nathan Wrigley: website.

Yeah, so they have also. Yeah. Yeah. Lots of additional functionality in Patch Stack as well. Yeah, they used to be called Web A, so if you see Web Arc anywhere, then that's the same product e r Yeah. About, are you, I don't know, two years ago they changed her patch stack cuz they thought it was a bit more of, a bit more of a sensible name.

Let's just get off into that tangent for a second cuz Ken's got me all intrigued with this password management thing. How do you even do that? How do you guys manage passwords with your clients? I am, I'm using basically last pass and if they're not willing to use Last Pass, that's that's a bit of a red light.

I I wanna know that they're gonna use something secure like Last Pass and I use their Share Center feature. And because LastPass is free I can't see any impediment to clients using that, even if they don't currently use it. But I would never send it over and, I wouldn't write a username and a password into the same email and send it to their, plain text email.

So what are you doing there, Ken?

[01:00:08] Ken Elliott: I'm trying to find a solution that is great for everybody. Now I know for me personally, cuz security and privacy is very important and I do not want private their, my client's passwords sent to me in an email or text. A lot of times I'll say, Hey, if you're gonna send me your password to log into your, to log into your site that I don't have access to send me a voice message.

At least that's not easily, it could be deciphered, huh? But a robot can't just read it off and then just route force attack into a site. So I normally would ask for a voice matches, but for me, I use one pass one password. Yeah. And that's how I don't like when people ask me what's, Passwords.

I have no idea what any of my passwords are. I don't know what my password for my banking information is. Yeah, I don't have any clue because I let one password manage all that stuff and if I don't have it, then I guess I'll be entering in for God.

[01:01:08] Nathan Wrigley: Password. Yeah. I'm the same years. It is probably a decade ago that I gave up trying to remember user names and passwords and I went to last pass.

I think basically there's feature parity, isn't there? One password last pass. All of these different password management solutions are basically doing the same thing. What about you Davinder? Would you send anything like that over the, I don't know, Facebook Messenger or , anything like that?

[01:01:33] Davinder Singh Kainth: I don't manage many client websites these days, but who manage like the sites I'm responsible for, Most of the clients have, do not have admin accounts.

They only have a ticket account, so they can't really do much damage. Plus, Eventually you will lose password here and there. So the best bet is just have your backup stuff ready, so so you can replace it. So that's, yeah,

[01:01:57] Nathan Wrigley: that's the only thing. Yeah. Yeah I guess my backup is basically last pass.

I've got a boatload in there and it does make me wonder if somehow that did get, let's say somebody put a key loger on my computer and they really do get my master password. I've got all sorts of backup authentication. So like last pass can't be opened until I use my, I've got this thing called a UBI key.

I dunno if you've come across a Ybi key before he said trying to find his ybi key there. , I've got one of these. You come across these before, it's like a, it's like a keyboard on a USB drive, and essentially you just plug it in. Last pass says, Okay, you've got your password right, Or it says something along those lines.

Now usually you be keen, and unless this device is enabled, and I press the bottom on the top, then last pass is locked anyway, So I've got backups for last pass, getting hacked as well. But I still entrust everything I've got. Shouldn't be saying all this should I, but I've basically given my whole entire life over to to last pass

So anybody wanna come around to my house and steal my ybi key? Good luck with that . Michelle, what about you?

[01:03:12] Michele Butcher-Jones: I have lots of opinions on this. One, definitely use a password manager, like last password, one password. Instead of using your browser, save passwords like in Safari or. Also how I send passwords over if they don't have last pass or one password, I can share it through them through the through that app.

I use either one Time Secret or Quick Forget um.com. One time secret.com. You can only send text messages, but with quick Forget, you can also do files which for like quick forget I can say if I'm sending it to all of us, that it can have up to three clicks on it and it'll expire in two hours.

So once all three of you click on it, it's done. Or if it's four hours later and someone didn't get theirs, it's still done because it's met. It's time for getting it. Yeah. And then also you can have it where there's a paraphrase too on both One Time Secret and Quick. Forget.

[01:04:24] Nathan Wrigley: That's interesting.

So they expire over time. If you don't get there quick enough, it just poof it's gone.

[01:04:30] Michele Butcher-Jones: And quick forget.com, if I remember right, is in Audrey Capital slash automatic option.

[01:04:36] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah, I've not heard of that one. I confess. Have any of you heard of Web Orth? because Web orth is a new so it's following the standards laid down by the FI oh two framework, which is what I won't get into all that, but there's this organization, Fido, which is like a protocol for doing things like passwords and user names and all of that.

And so this is now being backed by all these companies. So this is a pretty good laundry list. Firefox, Chrome, Edge, and Safari. They're building password authentication into the browser. So it's not gonna be the same as the browser remembering your username and password. It's that the browser will authenticate you based upon you having provided details to the browser.

For example, that could be on your mobile phone. You could say, Okay my fingerprint. Once it's been recognized on my phone, that is sufficient authorization to log me in to whatever it might be. And I think that's cool because we no longer have to remember username and passwords.

Is it insecure? Yes. Because if somebody can, knock you out with a frying pan and then steal your thumbprint, then you toast. But that's always been the case, right? Somebody could knock you out with a frying pin and the frying pan and steal your wallet. But it just strikes me as a really neat idea that biometric data potentially, or it could be face lock or it could be, who knows, but the secure enclave on your phone is gonna have information which will be able to log you into things in the future and hopefully be as much more frictionous.

I think Ithe security has recently added this layer into their security product for logging in as well, but I can't be a hundred percent sure about that. Yes. Last week

[01:06:32] Davinder Singh Kainth: I do

[01:06:32] Nathan Wrigley: weeks back, I think. Is it web oth? Have I got that

[01:06:34] Davinder Singh Kainth: right? , I have no idea. But yeah, they just launched it.

[01:06:39] Nathan Wrigley: They did something along these lines.

And so what the, what that does is you have to authenticate in your browser. It then stores some kind of token in your browser. And from that moment on, if you get a little bit of a, you get a popup notification, say in Chrome, you go to your website.com, slash WP admin whatever, and it says, do you wanna log in?

And you say Yes. And because it knows that you're allowed to log in there cuz you've entered details in the past and secured it with web orth, it allows you to log in without doing anything. You just press a button and you're off to the races, which is cool.

[01:07:16] Ken Elliott: Yeah. And I think it's, the goal is of course, to minimize the amount of logins that you have to do.

But the idea is if you are who you say you are, biometrics then. Hey, let's help you bypass this particular thing. So you don't have to worry about, So what actually happens is the applications and the websites, they look onto your particular device. This is one thing Apple was mentioned that they were really into is instead of having you to put your thumbprint or to do your screen, your face recognition, you just come on, you've already technically logged into your device.

Yeah. And then you're

[01:07:52] Nathan Wrigley: there. Yeah. That, that, that seems like a really frictionless way of doing things, doesn't it? In other words if you've already logged in through your face, Id you've done it already in the, So in the UK when phones started to be able to pay, there was a strict.

So NFC payments, like with a card, there was a strict limit, and I think it was like 30 pounds or something like that. Because there was a worry that if somebody ran away with your card, they could repeatedly spend 30, they could just essentially spend that amount over and over again, and there'd be no checks and balances.

And then as soon as Apple came out with Apple Pay, that limit from Apple Pay was removed because they realized, okay, it's behind another layer of security. You've obviously logged into the phone. It's pretty much guaranteed to be you. And if it's not you, hopefully you'll figure that out straight away.

But then other I've got, we've got other sort of interesting things happening as well. For example, my bank transactions, I've authorized my bank to take my fingerprint as the authority to do transactions. If I'm gonna send, spend a hundred dollars over here, my bank says, Whoa, wait a minute.

Amazon's just told us that you're trying to spend a hundred dollars. Did you really wanna do that? And so I'm on my desktop and then my phone beeps and I click a button on the phone and enter my fingerprint. And then the Amazon website refreshes and it's Oh, I don't even understand how any of that stuff's working, but it's really cool.

It feels nice and safe to me. Yeah.

[01:09:23] Davinder Singh Kainth: We have a similar system here, which is called UP Unified Payment System. It's a government system, so it's free. So everyone has now come on board with that. Like earlier you had to buy, use your, you have to log into your bank website to pay all this credit card, but now it's so simple.

Even Amazon has enabled it now. So you just click that U P I icon, add your u p i key, and you'll get a popup on your phone, like you've requested to pay this many amount on this. You just enter your ID and you're done. And up f will basically transfer your money from your bank account to the merchant and you can use it anywhere, Uber or Amazon, Netflix, everywhere.

[01:10:05] Nathan Wrigley: And that now internet banking's got to the point where, and I dunno what, it's the same as if it's the same for you, but I've got notifications for everything for my bank switched on. It's one of the few apps which I allow on my bank, on my phone to, to bleep at me any time of day or night. And even if I spend 15 pen, I'm gonna get a ping and I'm gonna get a notification.

So it's really, it feels as bulletproof as we can get's

[01:10:32] Davinder Singh Kainth: also, So say that. Also send you an SMS also for every transaction

[01:10:38] Nathan Wrigley: that you do. Yeah. And so you can see, every time somebody spends something and it, it's weird. You spend something on the desktop and your phone, which is in the other room, instantly goes bing bong, just to check, was this you?

Yeah, it was me. Stop worrying about it. I wonder if it becomes desensitized to those notifications and just dismiss them all. And the hackers will prey on that. Ken, do

[01:10:58] Ken Elliott: you think this would be something in the future, and I know we're talking about WordPress, do you think WordPress would see themselves implementing something like bio metrics to unlock

users?

[01:11:12] Davinder Singh Kainth: There could be a plug-in route .

[01:11:16] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Yeah. I would imagine that the bi the whole bio thing is so fraught with, if you are storing biometric data, I'm guessing you probably wouldn't wanna store that. In a my SQL database out there on the internet somewhere but having a having a SAS product or the browser handle it for you.

That's the other thing. I really don't have any insight into how Google, Firefox and Safari doing this. I'm just trusting that their tech is opt, is opt to monster. But I would fully would be, I would wish to be able to log in everywhere with my biometrics. And my understanding is at the moment the biometrics are pretty robust and I can imagine they're only gonna get better, those fingerprints, scanners in the years to comma, just gonna get better and better.

I'm on an Android phone and my understanding is that Android is lacking compared to Apple in all of this stuff. But I think they're, I think they're catching up fairly quickly. The only

[01:12:13] Michele Butcher-Jones: thing in way with biometrics that we have learned over the past two years is like when we're in the middle of a pandemic with the mask, there's that hiccup of you have to pull down your mask to get it to work, or something like that out in public.

So in a way there would be, it would almost be better if we could do maybe like eye recognition or something like that, that we don't have to take those in a way. Health measures of pulling down the mask in the middle of everyone just to get your bank app open to make sure you have enough money to pay for concert tickets or something like

that.

[01:12:52] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. There was a really interesting project by a guy called Steve Gibson. It was called Squirrel and it stood for sq, it was S Q R L and basically it was the idea that you would, on your phone, set up an identity. And if you lost it you're basically screwed. But the idea was that you would back it up somewhere.

Probably write it down on a piece of paper and stick it in a book on a shelf that nobody knows about, like a 16, 16 character string or something. That then becomes your identity online everywhere. And if you want to buy anything or log into anything, the website shows you a QR code, you scan it with your phone and then it immediately makes a handshake.

It completely secure handshake, so it logs you in. And it's the same details everywhere you go on the internet. And I find that really a big eyeing idea. The idea that the phone is the source of truth or whatever it may be. But you've got this one source of truth and I really like that. Of course, if you're forgetful and you lose your phone a lot and you don't write that sort of stuff down, then you're.

You're a bit fried. But anyway, go and Google Squirrel. Q r L. It was quite a nice idea. I dunno if it'll be taken off. Rob can says he uses, Where was it? Bit warden. But we used to start turning on two A. Yes. Turn on the two. A. I, I would, I dunno what bit ones like Last Pass has its own two FA solution, which syncs to your last pass account.

So you can take all those, or token all those two FA tokens and lock 'em into LastPass, which is quite nice. He also says he will not use biometrics because you can be compelled to open. In legally sorry. You can be compelled to open it by customs police and certain government agencies. Yeah, I've I've made peace with that because I figure thus far in my life, I haven't had too many encounters with customs or the police.

But that could change. Of course, I might become like, big bank robber tomorrow. I've got a, the vendor. That's what I'm gonna do tomorrow. I'm no longer gonna be buying fluent forms ninja tables. I'm gonna, I'm gonna go out and rob banks you can rob for me, but yeah, I get it. I get it.

If you can be enforced to, So this is where password's coming, right? Cuz the police can't. Decide what's in your head, but they can tell you to put your thumb on that there. Bit of glass,

[01:15:09] Davinder Singh Kainth: Bottom line is nothing is secure. A hundred percent. There's vulnerability in any system, Being government private, there's that.

So you just gotta live with it and pray port.

[01:15:20] Nathan Wrigley: So back it up, back up all the things, everything, back it up. Have backs of everything. . That's the key. Okay. We had a couple of articles about WordPress dramas. I don't think we're gonna get to those this week, but we are gonna mention a couple of other things.

We've got about 10 minutes left. We've straight off the straight off the path a little bit, but never mind. Davinder mentioned this. I was gonna mention this next week, but he got in there first. This is new, right? This is still like hot off the press. It's called WP turbo.dev.

What is this vin? What are we looking at? So basically

[01:15:55] Davinder Singh Kainth: it has all the, different types of online code generated tools, like post types. You want to build element of widget. There's so many of them. This is almost 40 plus, so this is free, but if you compare it with other, you're not generators.

Now most of them have become pro or paid. Now I think this also has a pro version where you can actually store your snippets. And we've already seen few services that does that. So basically they're offering generator plus a place to store snippet. Seems like a good idea. Let's see how it takes off, because I think it was launched last week.

Wouldn't,

[01:16:35] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. So this is cool. I stumbled across it independently of Davin. I was thinking, like I said, it didn't make the cut for this week. I was gonna do it next week. For example, this is for the people who Yeah. That you don't wanna be. I don't know how to describe it. You don't wanna describe yourself as a hardcore coder, but you would like to do things with snippets instead of installing a plugin to do all the things.

So for example, you can see here there are nine categories. You can do things like post type generator taxonomy, generator shortcut generator and other things. Theme dot j generator, Let's just click on the post type generator and it instantly gives you a ui. So there's the basics. You can give it a name and a function, sorry, a text domain and a function name.

You can, it can support child themes. You can talk about different post types labels. You can say what it supports. Oh, that's cool. Look, you just toggle 'em on and off. So is it gonna have an author, yes or no? Is it gonna have comments, yes or no? Taxonomies visibility. This is great. And it just amends the the snippet of the bottom on the fly and then you copy and paste it into well, functions dot php for one of a better place, let's say there.

That's cool. So at the minute post type taxonomy menu, short code. WP P WP config dot php generator starter plugin theme. Do Jason and WP Query generator. Ooh,

[01:17:56] Davinder Singh Kainth: brow button. And you'll see

[01:17:58] Nathan Wrigley: more of them. And there's more. 40 more. Oh, no kidding. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, is this them here? WordPress add. Okay. WordPress admin generators.

There's a bunch there. Query generators. There's a whole bunch there. Woo. Commerce. Oh, I didn't see this. Oh, Ken, look, Elemental generators. You can get your own elemental widgets. Let's see what happens if we do that. Ooh, look, that's fun. So it's for those of you who don't want to code but want to fiddle with you snippets instead.

I know a man who'll enjoy this. His name's David warns, Alex

[01:18:31] Davinder Singh Kainth: Portu, who also Marmite website.

[01:18:35] Nathan Wrigley: Say that again. Alex Porto. He was the guy that came up with this. Yes. And

[01:18:41] Davinder Singh Kainth: he also runs that website, wp marmite.com.

[01:18:43] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. Okay. Yeah, it's definitely new cuz if you look at the blog, it doesn't go back that far.

I think it's like a month old or something like that. Go and check it out W Turbo like this, so yeah. Yeah, it's really nice. Anything to say about this? You too, Ken. Michelle?

[01:19:02] Michele Butcher-Jones: No, I kind of wanna play with it now. .

[01:19:04] Ken Elliott: I do too and matter of fact, yeah, I'm wonder how long is going to be under free cuz?

A very robust generator. So we'll see how long this stays

[01:19:16] Davinder Singh Kainth: for storing your cloud snippets not for generators to what I have understood so far.

[01:19:23] Nathan Wrigley: The the another companion to this, I don't know if it does it tonda, maybe you can tell me. WP Code Box is a plugin that I've used recently and if Michelle and Ken, if you haven't come across this one, it's an absolute winner.

It's called WP Code Box and essentially, and it allows you to put things like these snippets into your WordPress website and then set conditions on when it'll run. So for example, you would say, Okay, only run this snippet if, I dunno, it's on this page, or if it's of this user role, or if the username is this.

Or well come up with anything if the landing page was this, or if the referer was this absolutely brilliant. And so I feel that these two would go really well together. They don't they dive? There is a growing library of snippets, but I don't know if it's quite as in depth as this.

[01:20:12] Davinder Singh Kainth: WP Code box has companion website called wp code bin.com, and that is where sharing the snippets and you can basically copy or change it.

Okay. So WP Code basically is only service to store your snippets on the cloud, whereas wp code.com is basically, user generated library of code snippets similar to Code Cloud from code snippets.com. That's another product which is similar on this slide.

[01:20:41] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, so you're wanting me to mention this one, you think?

Did you say Andrew Parer from Berra ai? He's behind this one. This is code snippets.cloud. Similar idea, right? Yep. This is

[01:20:51] Davinder Singh Kainth: free service, like you can store your snippets, but their main product is code snippets.com, which is basically the plugin and the cloud thing.

[01:21:00] Nathan Wrigley: Okay, so let me have a look at that. So if I go to w code snippets.com, is this it?

Is it loading or have I got there already? That was either really fast or it's still, Yeah, I think I got there. So this is where you, so is this the same idea? W code snippets.com, you can create your snippets and then you can save them into their cloud as well. Oh look, elemental ones ready How? Okay.

All right. They also have a

[01:21:26] Davinder Singh Kainth: preexisting snippets like you can also.

[01:21:30] Nathan Wrigley: Okay. All right. Okay. Thank you. The one we were mentioning today, WP turbo dot beta. Go and check that out. Sorry. WP turbo.dev. I'll put the link in the show notes and. Huh, I don't even know what to say about this. This is one from Groundhog.

It's not really related to WordPress, but it's to do with I guess we're all into email at some point in our lives, probably sending out, spraying out emails for clients and things like that. I had no idea this was a thing. Groundhog is saying that essentially. A lot of the emails that you send out will be returning completely irrelevant data about how many times they've been opened, because the techniques that we're using for measuring openings, which is very often something like a pixel, little image pixel, something like that.

And it will, phone home to say, Yes, I have been downloaded. Therefore, the email should have been opened. This is now a bit out of date because a lot of robots are opening these things. And the, a good example would be the following four things. Apple mail introduce something called mail privacy protection, which preloads all images resulting in inflated open rates.

In other words, if the recipient of your email is using apple mail, they will open it, whether they open it or. So you've already got a complete false positive. Maybe they just bend it, but Apple will have opened your pixel and so they'll have, you'll have got a one for that person. Gmail, prefetch images.

In some cases, whether the recipient opened it or not. And that's the biggest I dunno what it is, but it's something like, it's several billion people use Gmail. And if your users are using that, hey.com blocks, email tracking pixels together, that's a growing service. . And then there's things like spam filters, like Barracuda will also just go around visiting links, checking if they're malicious or not, which again is gonna inflate your click risk.

I had no idea this was even a thing. I confess on WP Builds, we send out weekly emails to a week. I don't look too much at the data, but it is weird to think that all of those stats that we once thought were useful are now probably not useful.

Yeah,

[01:23:44] Davinder Singh Kainth: there, there's no perfect answer to this, but what, whatever they've written is perfectly correct, but does that apply to everyone? I really don't know because in the end, if someone wants to, come on your email stuff, they will ask you what is your open rate and what is your click rate?

These are the two stats they will ask you, and you will only tell them what you know or what's it's there in your email marketing software. Now, if you have hosted. Email marketing software on your WordPress, which is connected to Amazon, or Amazon se or some other, transactional email service, then things might be a little difficult because you will not have manual, controls.

Whereas if you're using something like Convert Kit, Mail a light, or these kind of services, they have their, they are definitely one step ahead. Their game because again, they are in that business. So I think the next step would be how many email replies do you get to your email newsletter?

Yeah. So I often get it. So that means some people are reading it. So that's good enough for

[01:24:43] Nathan Wrigley: me. . Yeah. Yeah. I suppose what we really need is a manual reply. We can confirm that 6,000 people have manually replied saying Yes, I got your email, Nathan. Yeah. Just interesting. We seem to be in that era where people are definitely more privacy focused than they were five years ago, and this kind of data, which we once took for granted as a metric which we could rely on is slowly disappearing.

Do you do any of this kind of stuff? Michelle, Ken,

[01:25:09] Michele Butcher-Jones: on the us sending out the emails. Not for what I do, but where I work during the day does have a team that does email Marketing. Now for me as a reader, I am a avid Apple meal user, so yeah, unfortunately people are gonna think I open everything .

[01:25:33] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah. Which is interesting because, imagine that you are drilling down onto customers who, who are keen and engaged in your products or services.

Michelle, if I'm sending you an email twice a week and I see that you've opened every single one more or less as soon as I sent it I'm really thinking you are like a red hot customer of mine. Whereas in fact it's Apple Mail who's a red hot customer of mine and I might end up wasting a load of energy trying to, encourage you to buy things and pixel you with Facebook pixels and all of that kind of stuff.

So it's just muddying the water a bit, which I guess is the point. That's what these privacy initiatives are for. Make it as difficult as possible to get the data out and eventually, hopefully everybody just give up and throw their hands in the air and say, it's not worth it. . Can, any thoughts? If there's

[01:26:26] Ken Elliott: one thing we thought that was really sure in marketing was email.

We were almost guaranteed email was the last frontier when it came to, Hey, this is a guaranteed, this person on the other end of this email will respond. This is somebody who's a human and now we don't have that anymore. So now it becomes what's the point of online marketing at all? Why do it ? So yeah, hopefully there is a way like the vendor says to manually account for somebody who is truly interested in the email, but there's no guarantee at this point.

Let's just send out a whole bunch. Spam mail and see what happens.

[01:27:11] Nathan Wrigley: Yeah, it's interesting because in the day when we were all growing up, I say we were all growing up. I hope I'm not implicating that you are of a, . Let's let's hope none of you're in your early twenties. Put it that way.

The, obviously the internet didn't exist and stuff just dropped through your letter box and it was just largely a complete waste of money. You'd get a pizza menu or something like that and, 99% of that stuff would end up in the bin, the occasional one. It feels like that's where we're getting back to.

And we've just got used to the fact that we could shave off the wastage and figure out who was reading our stuff, and maybe that was something that was only gonna last in the Internet's infancy. And after a 20 years or so of the internet being about, we've eventually got savvy enough to realize, actually we don't want that anymore.

Let's go back to the day when marketers have got to waste money to try and find us. No doubt. They'll figure out another clever way to fingerprint us and get money out of us. .

[01:28:06] Ken Elliott: You know what's funny? We always think we can outsmart technology and then technology outsmarts us again. Yeah. And so now we gotta find another way to outsmart that technology.

Yeah.

[01:28:16] Nathan Wrigley: That's right. Gonna be ever going loop. Yeah. Yeah. There'll be something, There'll be somewhere doing it. Okay. The very last thing, we always do a sort of bit of the end, which has got absolutely nothing to do with the WordPress. This is my pick of the week, if you like. I'm gonna call it that.

I came across this website this week. I lost so many hours. It was ridiculous. This is called. Flight Radar 24. , . Whoa. So what this is, I'm just gonna refresh it cuz it'll, at some point it'll give up on me. What this is show , look at it. This is just showing, for those of you that are listening, I apologize.

It's showing all the flights that are in the air at the moment, and actually the ones on the tarmac as well. So the ones on the runway. And what you can do is you can install it on your phone and any plane that goes over you in the sky, you could see it on your phone screen. You just tap it and it tells you where the plane's coming from, where it's going to, what time it's set off, how many, how big the plane is, what kind it is, and all that kind of stuff.

And for the geek in me, I was totally lost. I honestly lost like several hours this week just nerding out on what plane could be flying overhead. And mostly what I was interested. Was how jealous I was of where their destinations were. That's what I figured out in the end. I just basically became a wire of, they're off to like Las Vegas.

Oh, they're off to Hon Lulu or something like that. Just feeling a little bit jealous about it all. I just thought this was a really cool website that I thought I'd share. I dunno if any of you got a chance to see this one, but it's very cool. Install it on your phone. It's a little bit like one of those website, those phone apps where you pointed at the sky at night and it shows you where the stars are and all that kind of stuff, and you nerd out on the constellations.

It's like a great example of what the web was for theory.

[01:30:08] Davinder Singh Kainth: Also where there was no flight. Just zoom out a little. Okay.

[01:30:11] Nathan Wrigley: See the places there? Yeah. Look here. This is like the Twilight Zone. Anything here is

[01:30:19] Davinder Singh Kainth: even takes. Planes say

[01:30:22] Nathan Wrigley: ships. The Bermuda Triangle is here, isn't it?

This is the Bermuda Triangle. It is largely bereft of airplanes, which is kind weird that there's not really a lot in there. They ought disappear at this boundary here. Anyway, just look at it. Look how many planes are in the sky at the minute. There's literally thousands of them. Is there any wonder?

But it is also interesting, it does point to a sort of geographical divide of how the world is prosperous if you like. If you look at Europe and North America, it's just basically a sea of airplanes and you you move it elsewhere into different parts of the world and it really is a different picture.

Absolutely fascinating. So that's called Flight Radar 20. dot com. Don't blame me if you go there this week and you never come up for air because it's a hot mess. Once you get into it, I honestly wasted a bunch of time, right? That's it. We're finished for this week. I don't know if you guys wanna just quickly share something that you're doing this week or where we can find you.

Let's go around one at a time and you can tell us where we can find you this week, what you're doing. First off, Ken, what you're up to this week and where can we find you online? I am doing my

[01:31:33] Ken Elliott: favorite theme, making sure my client's websites are very protected and they're providing strong passwords.

Outside of that you could find me on, at Ken, I speaks on Twitter, Instagram you can find me Kenneth Elliot on LinkedIn and all of the things. So yeah, just please follow me and hey, I love to chat. I'm the social, I'm the networking introvert, but I love to chat.

[01:31:59] Nathan Wrigley: Nice. Thank you for joining us this week, Ken.

Appreciate it. Michelle, what about you? What you doing and where can we find

[01:32:05] Michele Butcher-Jones: you? I'm going to be working on my slides for the work X 24 or virtual conference November 2nd and third. Because that's, I try my best to not be one of those who, Oh, that's like tomorrow when I need hurry. Haven't finish my slides.

[01:32:29] Nathan Wrigley: can I ask what your presentation is concerning? What are you covering?

[01:32:33] Michele Butcher-Jones: I am going to be covering, not everybody wants a video. I, it's going to be about with accessibility that you might not think of when it comes to posting the like Facebook Lives and talks and things like that where number one you are betting on their closed caption is, which.

I hardly ever really get it right, fully, especially if you're using different types of slanging words. And then also so many people now for your neuro divergence would rather just have their toenails pulled out than just sit there and watch videos. especially like learning something. I'm one of those who will like fast forward pods and all of that with videos when I'm trying to learn something because either they're just going too slow or too fast and it would be so much easier if I just had a print out of everything it's said.

And so it's gonna be half of Michelle ranting about videos and the other half of what we can do to make it better.

[01:33:38] Nathan Wrigley: That's cool. So that's the word press accessibility day. We've talked about it for several weeks in the run up to it. So hopefully if you've been listening to this, you've got the URL written down there somewhere.

But thank you Michelle. Fighting the good fight. Well done. And Davinder, what's happening and oh, it's counting votes. Is it? No,

[01:33:55] Davinder Singh Kainth: that will happen in

[01:33:56] Nathan Wrigley: December. Oh yeah. . Yeah.

[01:33:58] Davinder Singh Kainth: I'll just following up with WP things and WordPress things, but this week would be a busy week because it's at the Valley weekend, so a lot of holidays here, the busiest part of the year.

So I'll be busy offline with a lot of things. So yeah, our Christmas Oh, Christmas up side of the world. So yeah, the most, So all the market's already all lit up with lights and all that stuff,

[01:34:22] Nathan Wrigley: Oh, very nice. Yeah. Happy Devali in that case. I hope you have a nice time. Thanks for anybody who joined us and made a comment.

Really appreciate it. We'll be back next week. We'll have a different panel of guests, but for this week, I forgot to say Ken, Michelle and Davinder, We've gotta do the old wavy hand thing, if you don't mind. Yeah. Oh look, everybody, look at that straight away. Thank you very much indeed. We'll be back next week.

Really appreciate your participation. Thanks very much. See you again. Bye.